New Haven Independent

Posted by: king james v | July 17, 2007 9:40 AM

Why not get serious about recycling instead of regulating what every bodega, grocery store and package store put their products in. It is something that can be put into effect quicker, and puts the onus on the city of new haven itself. Every city in California and many on this side already have those big recycling bins, they are about the size of the City of New Haven official trash can on wheels, and make it easier for us regular folk to recycle. more than half the stuff we put in the regular garbage can be recycled. That leaves more landfill space, less trafic trucked somewhere else, and puts those offending bags back into circulation. The mayor and aldermen need be tough with our sanitation and get this done now.
as far as the bags themselves, maybe the city can give a little token in the form of some kind of break to businesses who choose to use biodegradable products. or maybe the mayor could come out in his prius and give them a hug for being green.

Posted by: Taxed To Death | July 17, 2007 10:02 AM

The very idea that this plastic bag ordinance would save the city money is as far fetched as the Shartenberg welfare plan. The budget line item for garbage collection escalated by 21% this budget year -- The mayor and his minions, including Alder Sturgis-Pascale said it was because we're doing such a great job recycling. So re-cycle. I will also note that while the cost of plastic bags is incorporated into our food costs, the compostable ones cost even more and are made from corn. Our food costs are already rising because of ethanol. Even tortillas in Mexico are rising faster than what people can pay. We really want to raise food costs even higher by using food products for bags? I think not. I have a hard enough time already making my money stretch far enough to pay the outrageous taxes imposed by the King and his Court.

Posted by: Pedro | July 17, 2007 10:23 AM

I could not find this information on the City's website, so perhaps someone has this information:
Are the plastic bags currently allowable as part of New Haven's recycling program?

If that is not the case, then that might be a great way to start increasing the recycling of these bags. So many people already recycle, that it would be very simple to bundle the bags up with a rubber band and toss them into the blue bins.

As an aside, it would be great if the City of New Haven's website had a clear list of what was and was not recylable. I was unable to find an electronic copy of that information on it.

There was a very interesting report the other day on NPR about Ireland, or possibly the UK who introduced similar legislation, and they found that there are hidden drawbacks in the overall supply chain. Because larger, heavier bags need to be produced and made available, the transportation cost and use of trucks actually increased, offsetting the environmental benefit to using them via increased emissions.

Posted by: A greener New Haven | July 17, 2007 10:45 AM

I think this is a great stride for New Haven in terms of living greener. We can all talk about recycling and though it remains a vital coponent in cutting down on waste, but the reality is that some many simply don't! I won't even start about the litter plastic bags create not only in New Haven, but globally. Until people act responsiblly we need to seek alternatives... bottom line. I think a plastic-bagLESS City would be great!

Posted by: write&wrong | July 17, 2007 11:40 AM

What is next? Regular garbage bags, sandwich bags...please. Perhaps we should ban bottled water too. The costs of shipping bottled water clearly is bad for the environment. The city has bigger issues than this to look at.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=11523344

Posted by: on whalley | July 17, 2007 1:22 PM

I'm going to begin hoarding as many plastic bags as I can to sell them on the coming black market.

Maybe if we all shopped at Save-A-Lot we wouldnt use so many plastic bags?

And what will all the enviro-nuts say when the use of the paper bags jumps through the roof? Paper comes from trees you know. Soon they may not be any left to hug.

I'm all for not wasting land as landfills and chopping down acres and acres of trees for paper but why do people always think the answer is in banning and punishment and more legislation? Try a reward system. 5% off your bill for using your own bags or something similar. I an outdoorsy guy but I's be willing to stip mine the nation for spite of more legislation and punishment.

While we're at it how about a tax break for riding a bike everywhere? I have to shop with my own bag when I go to the store on my bike. Double discount!

Instead I get charged more for having a pick-up that sees maybe 40 miles a month just because its a pick-up. Perhaps I should use it everyday for no reason other than spiting this backwards system of tax and punish rather that reward and encourage? I'll go home and let it idle in front of the house for 16 hours. Maybe I'll even throw some oil on the manifold. Why not? I'm paying for the penalties. I may as well get my moneys worth.

And it all comes down to assinine things such as carbon-offset scams and global emissions taxes. I'd ask if a little common sense was too much to expect but life has taught me it is. It is definitely too much to expect. Save a tree, support global government and indentured servitude?

Posted by: HeavyD | July 17, 2007 1:57 PM

Sure, bottled water is a problem, but spare me the "this problem isn't as big as another one I can think of" argument. If they can tackle plastic bags, let them tackle plastic bags.

Plenty of people like to recycle. Plenty don't. If we can create a meaningful recycling incentive that encourages non-recyclers to do something with the bags, great. If we're just making it easy to recycle these bags, it still ain't easier than just throwing them out without bothering to sort them, or even just littering. Let's just be up front with the costs and charge consumers for the bags. I bet folks will start bringing their own bags (the best choice) rather quickly. Before anyone starts whining about how that's unfair to people who can't afford bags, the bags are of course built into grocery prices as a hidden cost; nobody's giving them away. They sure don't grow on trees, do they? ;)

Posted by: Chip Croft | July 17, 2007 1:58 PM

I worked for the DuPont, Bayer and several other plastics companies in senior marketing positions. I worked on developing plastic packaging and bags. I was also highly active in an environmental group in the 80s and 90s where we pioneered the push to keep plastic bags and materials out of the water because they can kill leatherback sea turtles as well as some small whales and dolphin. I have seen first hand what they do. However, from seeing the situation from both sides I favor the continued use of plastic bags because in the end they benefit the environment over paper bags. We must continue legislation and education to have consumers use the bags properly and develop new plastics that degrade more rapidly while still being useful and economical. Meanwhile, plastics are made from distillation of petroleum for gasoline and until we no longer need gasoline we should still use their by-products (plastics, rubber, asphalt, etc) until better products are developed. Otherwise these products will be dumped into the environment. Paper is not a good option. Ultimately it consumes trees, recycled or not, and paper plants give off noxious odors and release acids. Plastic bags are easily recycled, are much more useful to consumers and have a very high reuse ratio. I say let consumers vote by chosing at the store and keep educating people on recycling of plastic materials. Keep them out of the water please! Also releasing helium ballons is bad because they frequently land in the Sound and choke sea turtles.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | July 17, 2007 4:33 PM

Pedro
I don't think they take them from the blue bins. When the truck does come they alway leave them behind. Some stores have a bin for you to drop them off at.
I do think we need to expand on what we can recycle in New Haven. The web site for Public Works need to have more info! That would save the city money in the end to!

And yes "on whalley" I want trees to hug!! And I find that this will have the stores opt to buy the paper over the corn bags and that is not earth friendly at all.
They need to figure out a way to recycle them!!

I don't buy my food in New Haven so do I get fined for trasporting plastic bags over the boarder??

Posted by: write&wrong | July 17, 2007 5:33 PM

i am happy to say that i do recycle my plastic bags. i pick up my dogs poop with it. imagine if those dedicated dog owners can't pick up poop. I am sure city leaders will get a flood of calls if no one is picking up poop.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | July 18, 2007 10:26 AM

one more question...does the ban on plastic bags also apply to the drug dealers?? I fine more of those on my street than I do shoping ones??

Posted by: Our Town | July 18, 2007 2:55 PM

CHR...Only if their gross sales are over $3 million annually.

Posted by: moegardner | August 3, 2007 12:06 PM

The answer seems simple enough: charge people for bags (paper or plastic) and see how quickly they remember to bring their own and/or reuse plastic ones. Think about the bottle bill: if plastic water bottles had a deposit, we would definitely recycle more than the 1 in 5 that we recycle currently. I appreciate Chip's comments as they illustrate that a solution is not always as straightforward as it seems (i.e. using paper INSTEAD of plastic). In general, I'm not for ordinances or legislation to force behavior change, but we can't seem to care enough unless it costs us money.