New Haven Independent

Posted by: cedarhillresident | May 1, 2008 2:13 PM

I love the A Park Pitch by hmmm what is that groups name ...oh yeah Archstone... That whole plan is a winner there presentation is amazing!! And so are the resumes! :)

Posted by: Charlie | May 1, 2008 2:16 PM

Ok folks, here it comes. And the winner of the latest City Hall sweepstakes is . . . . (whoever teams with Fusco).

Posted by: Webblog 1 | May 1, 2008 2:26 PM

Wouldn't it be nice if:

Wouldn't it be nice if the city balanced the assignment of review committees towards a review aimed at up grading the neighborhood in fractures. After all, the neighborhoods with their bloated property assessments have supported the expansion of down town growth since the 1960's, without pay back.
Every time one picks up a paper or on-line news we are bludgeoned with more and more down town development, paid for, if not by city neighborhoods, then by state bonds and pilot, or federal grants. Either way you cut it..it's taxpayers pockets.

So what about it Kelly Murphy, a little thinking out of the downtown box wouldn't stress your mind or talent, would it.....??

Posted by: pedro | May 1, 2008 2:29 PM

I LOVE the concept of 10th Square. Related Companies' concept is also excellent. It's very exciting that so many heavyweights are interested in investing in New Haven! Hopefully the construction of this will attract more investment in the surrounding area.

Posted by: Name Withheld | May 1, 2008 3:00 PM

Pick the group with financing, that can develop as soon as possible. Almost anything would be better than a parking lot.

Posted by: JP | May 1, 2008 3:51 PM

Every time we talk about this space someone mentions a hotel but the city has study after study that says the area can't support another hotel. So id say right off the bat any of them that pitch a hotel will have to change.

I think the parks look great and an ice skating rink would be fun as well.

Whoever came up with the "Tenth Square" name has clearly never seen a map of New Haven.

Posted by: kevin | May 1, 2008 6:32 PM

JP, have you noticed that the Colony Inn on Chapel is adding a floor? (I believe that they are doing this solely with private funds.)

Posted by: ROBN | May 1, 2008 6:38 PM

JP,

Could you please identify the source of your information about hotel density in New Haven?

Posted by: robn | May 1, 2008 6:41 PM

BTW...I'll say it again...it would be really nice if the city would post submissions for such important projects on their website. I'd love to have a lok at everyones proposal.

Posted by: TrueBlueCT | May 1, 2008 8:12 PM

Aaack! Heyman Properties is the Heyman family who were HUGE Lieberman backers. Add in Lynn Fusco as Lieberman's treasurer, and there is your presumptive front-runner.

Posted by: Gary Doyens | May 1, 2008 9:04 PM

Love the 10th Square idea and I'm very familiar with the company - they have plenty of money and are privately held and very well run. As with all these proposals...let's see the details of what they will require from the city in return and what if any caveats there are.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | May 1, 2008 9:54 PM

JP it is the 10th square. I am excited about the development. more taxes coming in!! I hope the knights grow here to!! Look how fast the New State street Development is going up. Soon that will be a bustling area! As long as they fill it the right way.

I have my problems with the city but I will never stop Revenue building ideas and this is just that!

Still love the Archstone one :) Alot of great New Haven minds involved in that! They know and love this city! That makes a big difference when developing an area!

Posted by: nfjanette | May 1, 2008 10:12 PM

Pick the group with financing, that can develop as soon as possible. Almost anything would be better than a parking lot.

...not to the rail commuters that have been using those parking spaces in lieu of the much-promised, never delivered increased parking at Union Station.

Posted by: nfjanette | May 1, 2008 10:14 PM

According to the RFQ, proposals must include space for a new home for the Long Wharf Theater...

What about the putting the LWT at the Palace Theater across the street from the Shubert? It's a fantastic space sitting unused.

Posted by: nfjanette | May 1, 2008 10:18 PM

Developers Related teamed up with New Haven's Robert Orr & Associates. In their vision, new streets would chop the block up into smaller pieces, with mostly three-to-five-story buildings

Now, that's what I'm talking about - rationally scaled buildings. What's up with the rush to (further) destroy the skyline of the city. This isn't Hartford, thank God.

Posted by: Hope | May 1, 2008 11:18 PM

I agree--the longterm plan favors human scale not megaplex. My vote is Robert Orr.

Posted by: jp | May 2, 2008 1:57 AM

to kevin,
adding 1 floor what is that 5 rooms?

Robn, here you go http://www.cityofnewhaven.com/economicdevelopment/pdfs/Update4_Apr2006.pdf from the city which says it would require money to be viable. heres a link to the rest of the plaing for the site you can see before april it was always part of the plan after they got the study back the hotel idea was dropped http://www.cityofnewhaven.com/economicdevelopment/GatewayProjectUpdates.asp

cederhillresident,
really the 10th square really? http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=06510&ie=UTF8&ll=41.307423,-72.926431&spn=0.016667,0.039997&z=15 the 9th square is george church chapel and state can you show me how you fit a 10th square in the 9 squares that makes up the orginal city state, george, york and grove with college, church, elm and chapel makeing the squares (Forgetting of couse that george and state were rivers at the time)

sorry for any typos and mis-spellings its been a long thursday night

Posted by: pedro | May 2, 2008 10:17 AM

JP, they're not trying to "fit" a 10th square into the 9 squares, the 10th square is "tacked on" to the southern portion of the original squares. 10th square would be a perfectly appropriate name.
I wouldn't mind one or two large buildings, so long as there were additional smaller buildings on the site. Financing is definitely key. I'm also intrigues at people who want to bring a downtown shopping area into that part of town. A retail area would be perfect in that part of town. Robert Orr's idea would include 200,000 square feet of retail! I like the concept of having one or two signature buildings to balance the site as well...

Posted by: ROBN | May 2, 2008 10:31 AM

JP,

Thanks...its not your fault, but I waskind-of hoping that there would be timely postings of all documents submitted to the city for big econ-dev projects like this. I don't think that we should have to wait for the 5th estate to make an FOPI request before RFQ and RFP responses are released. They should be posted promptly after reciept. They are, after all, documents owned by taxpayers.

I agree with NFJANETTE.... Our skyline can take some towers if they're really special, but ours is a low scale city.

Posted by: jp | May 2, 2008 10:36 AM

ill settle for 10th rectangle i guess.

Posted by: Esbe | May 2, 2008 11:32 AM

It would be great if New Haven had a retail district like Blue Black Square in West Hartford, except that in New Haven it would be less "fake urban" and more actually urban. The Coliseum acreage is probably a bit less than the Blue Black area, but it is surrounded by complementary uses that would effectively extend its size.

Posted by: Kevin | May 2, 2008 12:32 PM

JP the expansion is 40 rooms.

Posted by: visitor | May 2, 2008 2:09 PM

i don't know about the "tenth square". while that is a cute and catchy name, what that developer did in hartford did not fit well with surrounding buildings and the "high end" apartments/condos had rubber, dorm like "baseboards".

Posted by: pedro | May 2, 2008 2:46 PM

ESBE, 100 gazzilion percent with you on a Blue Back Square type design in New Haven. It would be the perfect location as well (right off the highway but right downtown as well!). It could be what the chapel square mall originally was going to be. That deal fell through because New Haven and the State had settled on the macy's building for gateway, and the developer wanted both the macy's site and the mall to develop into a mall.

Posted by: dylan | May 2, 2008 5:24 PM

I wish a visual of one of Cesar Pelli's designs had been shown. This is a chance to really show your stuff and he's incredible architect. Archstone is a pretty serious developer, and CA White is all over downtown, having done some really good work.

I don't know much about Heyman or Richman, but find it interesting that Richman interpreted the affordable housing requirement as artist and young professional housing, not subsidized.

New Haven doesn't need another expensive to build 30 story tower to hide the sun from the street and sidewalk. Haven't we gotten over the 60's yet? I remember Robert Orr's Shartenberg design being dense and genuine without looming over people or stacking a behemoth parking garage. I still don't know why it wasn't chosen. Maybe this will be his redemption. And if anybody on this list is capable and financially sound, it's Related.

Tenth Square sounds a little cheesy, not to mention a bit self-righteous. Plus, I'm unnerved because of the shaky residential occupancy of Northland's Hartford 21 and the emptiness of all of their retail space after a couple years. Of course, that might have to do with Hartford, not just Northland.

Oh, and on the slight chance that the city settles on Avalon Bay, I might drown in my own tears. I can see it now - "Avalon Coliseum" or "Avalon Elm" Can you say cookie cutter?

Looking forward to hearing more as this all unfolds.

Posted by: LiverLover | May 3, 2008 11:45 AM

The concept of "Tenth Square" is a ridiculous one. JP alludes to the problem when he suggests that commenters look at the original city plan.

They might also look back at their elementary school math textbooks. Ninth Square makes sense, because nine is a perfect square. The original plan was a square of squares - symmetrical, elegant, classically esthetic.

Add another square, even one that is a bit tongue-in-cheek, and we might as well call it "Tenth Complex Polygon", "Tenth Polyp", or "That Thing That Sticks Out, Ruining Our Neo-Classicist Love of Symmetry".

Please do not misunderstand - the project appears to be just as reasonable as the others proposed. However, the lack of attention to New Haven's history is quite disappointing.

Posted by: Chris Gray | May 5, 2008 1:31 AM

I am not going to pretend that I can choose a design that would best serve the city, though I see a lot of sense in some of the posters' comments. I tend to think Charlie and Truebluect are correct about how and to whom the commission will be given.

While I would love to see the Palace operating in some fashion, I really can not imagine the Long Wharf Theater being shoehorned into that space, as Nfjanette suggests. To begin with, they have historically been performing on a thrust stage and the Palace has a proscenium arch. I'm not even certain that the Palace was ever a real theater, as opposed to the movie house I remember from the '50s and '60s. Beyond that, I am unaware of any space available there for set and property construction, something a resident company would require, as opposed to the shows trucked into the Shubert. Plus, doesn't Long Wharf have a Stage 2?

Unlike with the attachment many of us have for the Shubert, either due to sentiment or profit motive, Long Wharf Theater really has long been a genuine New Haven cultural crown jewel. If they are to move, it should be into an improved 21st Century facility not to a rehabbed 19th or 20th Century one. No responsible Board of Directors would agree to that at this juncture.