New Haven Independent

Posted by: strangerthanfiction | October 22, 2008 5:57 PM

I remember reading in the Register that Amendola had offered several givebacks to the city before this last round of layoffs, including sacrificing part of the annual raise, furloughs, etc. but the mayor rejected them all. Despite the union's spirit of cooperation and having lost dozens of employees anyway, the mayor seems intent on reopening the contracts. The mayor can keep laying off until he gets the contracts reopened as he wishes. But the question is: why commit to union agreements you don't intend to honor? And why has the mayor apparently declined the concessions Amendola offered?

Posted by: Westville Mom | October 22, 2008 6:18 PM

I don't get this: "trek across town" ?? For years and years, this administration has touted its "magnet school" system for elementary grades, which has resulted in MANY kids trekking "across town" via school buses. Some of us haven't even been able to send a child to our "neighborhood" school because he/she wasn't one of the "chosen ones" in the lottery. (Haven't you all seen all the buses lined up at schools?)
Here's a suggestion Mayor---make all the elem. schools neighborhood schools again and get rid of all the buses. Not only will you be making the environmental orthodoxy happy by lowering pollution (aka CO2) levels, but you will cut the school budget. ....and you MIGHT even be able to attract a few new residents to the city to prop up the tax base. (Do you have ANY creative thinkers in that City Hall?)

Posted by: It takes a village | October 22, 2008 6:24 PM

When is this move happening,and why not merge Davis and Sheridan?It seems like Westville has alot of schools with Davis,Sheridan,Beecher and Edgewood.Why not make all our schools K-8?I also don't understand putting all the high schools downtown.This becomes a security problem using city buses instead of school buses;police are now needed on the green.The school building committee is using locations that do not make sense.The city can't rent or sell these locations to anyone else,so the unusable space becomes a school.Think about putting a high school in the middle of a nightclub district like the new Coop Arts High School,while still trying to curb underage drinking and teen fights at the clubs.Also,the new Metropolitan Business Academy is being built on an overly congested,dangerous corner of Water street right off a highway exit full of truck traffic.Currently Metropolitan is located in a rented space,but at least it has access to fields and safe walkable sidewalks.Other options were explored like East Street where there were strip clubs and adult businesses,but rather than use eminent domain to clean up a neighborhood our mayor would rather use eminent domain to take taxpayers homes.We were also told the space was too large,but the adult education program could have been added to that location to help serve the largely immigrant manufacturing community in the area.If we really want to put our kids first become involved in your schools and speak up for all our children.

Posted by: The truth | October 22, 2008 6:39 PM

This pyriah DeStefano must go. He has not even thought of giving his raise back. He now expects more people to lose there jobs so he can build more schools. Its easy. Dont bond Dwight and Mauro schhols. That will be a start. Even Governor Rell is not talkinmg about laying off state staff.

Posted by: It takes a village | October 22, 2008 7:38 PM

What about offering teachers a chance at early retirement before 37 years on the job, instead of laying anyone off?I bet any one of us would be burned out before that;state employees can retire after 20 years.Maybe Destefano should reconsider his pay raise or even consider spending some time in our public schools The teachers are overworked and although the buildings look great on the outside they are not clean and kids are sharing books.Forget about funding after school programs,it's more productive to keep the kids off the street with long bus rides to and from school.Homework help means helping your friends remember to not leave it on the bus.The schools that are able to offer after school programs have more kids than openings.Please lets put the focus back where it belongs on our kids well being.City violence is at an all time high and we are closing schools,libraries and cutting positions in our parks and rec department.

Posted by: anon | October 22, 2008 8:55 PM

The Mayor probably didn't agree to the "concessions" because he knows that he's going to have to get much bigger concessions next year, when state tax revenues plunge by 50%. Expect across the board staff reductions, more school closings, and salary cuts of up to 70% or as we enter a global depression. Silver lining - maybe kids will go back to walking to school like they did 20 years ago and the unions will no longer control the school system.

Posted by: SteveJ | October 22, 2008 9:48 PM

The closing of schools and stopping school construction to some degree is a testament to overbuilding in the first place.

Posted by: STOP !!!! | October 22, 2008 10:22 PM

Stop School construction 100%
The city has billed the state for $48 million over runs this year. The states not paying.
thats $48 million down next year before any other budget cuts. Try buying the kids some text books. might work and very cheap. If your american and work for the city youll get minimum wage next year. Look out Kelly Murphy, Andy Rizzo, Richard Miller, John Prokop, Mark Pietrosimone, Bob
Levine and the rest. You think you moneys been cut this year. Theres an illegal waiting to take your job right now. Taxpayers. Yo will be paying double your tax property next year to get nothing. Thats the interest monwey on the schools built now.

john deStefanos an investment banker. All you suckers voted for him gonna have you wallets emptied big time.

Posted by: Gary Doyens | October 22, 2008 10:22 PM

Years of mismanagement have brought the city to this place, not the economy or the state. Those economic problems just magnify DeStefano induced damage. In flush years, Mayor DeStefano spent all the excess funds, went on an unsustainable building spree; hiring spree; approved excessive union contracts; substantial, yet unwarranted increases in the school budget; borrowed money for the smallest of capital projects including sidewalk and street repairs in order to keep spending more and more money.

Among the ideas the mayor floated at his news conference is a local sales tax or local income tax which will need state approval. These are bad ideas that will sink the city even lower.

The city must get back to basics and eliminate all positions that do not serve core services. Unfortunately, there needs to be a sizeable layoff of city employees and consolidation of departments. The union contracts have to be re-opened and brought back to reality in terms of pay and benefits.

Posted by: dean moriarity | October 23, 2008 2:04 AM

The national fiscal situation does have impact on every city. Economics 101. But I just can't get over my awe (maybe disgust might be a better word) at how John DeStefano has manipulated the current crisis to his own advantage. He was accomplished at attacking Hartford for our woes, placing the blame at Rell's feet. Now he has a greater opportunity by addressing the "national financial crisis" and it's impact on New Haven. All of you folks must recognize by now where the blame lies. Losing your home to foreclosure? Can't walk on your streets at night (or day)? Getting laid off (while your mayor receives a raise)? Paying 30% more taxes on a house you have no chance of selling? It's not New Haven, it's a national thing now.

If we listen to the Gospel, we don't need to blame this Administration's failures and errors. We just need to look National. Thanks for making that clear, Mr. Mayor.

I need to retract what I said about awe and disgust. I actually am in awe of this Mayor. He's managed to pull the wool over so many New Haven eyes. Great accomplishment.

Posted by: ANONTOO. | October 23, 2008 2:21 AM

Yep,let's take more valuable downtown property off the tax rolls for non-profits. More bars downtown.Just what we need. Spend , spend , spend. We'll just raise property taxes more. It's been New Haven's way, especially since we have a one party town.This is what happens when democrats rule and FUSCO CORP needs work.
TAKE NOTE FOR WHEN YOU VOTE FOR PRESIDENT.
I don't see the mayor leading the charge and giving back HIS RAISE!!!

Posted by: Jane Doe | October 23, 2008 7:46 AM

With my pension gone, layoff possible, or a pay cut, do you think I care about the children I teach.

Posted by: Margaret | October 23, 2008 9:16 AM

If he is planning on a huge city layoff (which is probably going to happen) he needs to give back the raise he gave himself.

The Mayor has built way to many schools, and spent the funding on other ventures. He's employed way to many city workers, he is completely out of control. Someone needs to audit GENERAL FUNDS I wonder what is getting payed out of this!!

built,spend, and tax!!! This is all he knows.

Posted by: jdavis | October 23, 2008 9:24 AM

Jane Doe,
you should! its your job! if you dont care, then you should be fired. I cant believe you are that self centered to not care about the children [which is the only reason you have a job to begin with]

Posted by: Tired of the mayor! | October 23, 2008 12:33 PM

Amid Crisis the Mayor needs to look at some of his program that costing millions before layoffs.

Universal Lunch costing the City millions and millions each year.

Between the cost of food going up and what you actualy get back from the state. Not covering the cost of food and labor. Leaving the taxpayer to foot the bill for people who can afford to feed their children. (It would still be free or reduced for the people who truly need it.)

This is just one place he could save millions and jobs. No one wants to see jobs cut.

Posted by: joey nardo | October 23, 2008 2:19 PM

Gary doyens you are right about some of the things you posted.But very misinformed when it comes to what you said about big union salaries and pensions.I work for the city also a union employee i make peanuts i cant even survive. You want to see people get laid off how would you feel if you got laid off.the city is top heavy and they are the people that are killing the system.The same top heavy people thought it would be smart to hire a management commpany to look over the people that the city all ready hired to look over. A year from now we will have more managers then workers.

Posted by: Steve J. | October 23, 2008 2:28 PM

Gary Doyens for mayor?

Posted by: Common Sense | October 23, 2008 2:35 PM

Our Board of Aldermen and State Representatives/Senate need to rethink their past actions that are part of this mess for supporting the spend, spend concept that means tax, tax. It's a new ball game and we are all watching you. It's not about Democrats and Republicans - its about accountability to your tax paying constituents.

Posted by: tired | October 23, 2008 2:59 PM

Why are we looking at union people? Lets look at at every one that works in the city.Start at the top and work your way down,lets go by salaries and start the give back, no we want to go after the people making the lowest wage. This city is so screwed up its a joke will somebody help.

Posted by: strangerthanfiction | October 23, 2008 3:10 PM

I've counted four times this year that the Mayor has come after city unions. Nothing seems to be enough for him and now he just wants to rip up existing contracts. I can see why the morale and ability of the city work force to function has been so impaired.

Posted by: concrenedwestvilleres | October 23, 2008 4:36 PM

The economic crisis will affect many cities and many people throughout the cities. This is going to be a long crisis that may extend through the next president's first term and beyond. The national government is in debt to the tune of $10 trillion. The State deficit is expected to be $800 million next year. Many of the Greenwich "fat cats" are losing a lot of money and as a result tax revenues for the state are down. Additionally, many small businesses and large businesses will be laying people off.

The question is how to handle this. The mayor is going after the libraries, schools, and lower-paid city employees. This isn't right. Each area's budget needs to be scoured for waste. Higher paid city employees should consider salary reductions or benefit reductions to keep people employed. Another issue to address is Yale and the fact that many Yale employees live outside the city and yet use city services-- maybe a commuter tax could be put in place. A hotel tax would be good except the biggest user of the hotels, Yale, is tax exempt. Another thought is to start having churches and other nonprofits pay property taxes (not necessarily at the same rate as the current mill rate but maybe at a reduced rate). Maybe it's time to scrap PILOT - will Yale leave New Haven if it has to pay more taxes? Maybe PILOT payments should go directly to the cities and not the state and then we'd see the money.

Solutions aren't easy, but they are there. I know this, however-- raising property taxes again will have a brutal effect on property values and the ability of people to stay in their houses. A city income tax would encourage people who work in the city to live outside the city. A city sales tax would encourage people to go to Milford, North Haven, Orange, or Meriden for their shopping.

A great solution would be to replace the Mayor and his band of merry people. DeStefano, Smuts, Murphy, Bonanno, etc. should all be gone and the sooner the better.

Posted by: Steve J. | October 23, 2008 4:39 PM

The problem with this administration doing lay-offs is good people lose their jobs and the political dead weight keep theirs.

Posted by: jeffreykerekes | October 23, 2008 5:25 PM

People who say we are top heavy and have political dead weight please name names. We need a list to work from not vague accusations. If you know of political appointments, people sleeping on the job, incompetents, redundancies, etc... Name names, locations, departments etc... so we can investigate.

Posted by: Analyze This | October 23, 2008 6:49 PM

Jeffrey Kerekes

As the person who tried to get water coolers eliminated from City Hall you are now considered political dead weight. Even Johnny Boy didnt cut them from the budget.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | October 23, 2008 6:50 PM

Wow love this thread

strangerthanfiction Some of the union contract are totally out of control they need to be scraped and redone!

Steve J. I agree on your first and second statement.

But Jeffery is right. People know where the problems are and the people that are the problems. Yet know one will step up to the plate with them. To all that are reading if you know of any political appointments, people sleeping on the job, incompetents, redundancies, etc you can send the info to all@nhcan.org We will keep it private. And will do our best to look into it and present it to the right people.

I am glad that some change is starting to happen on the spending spree on some levels! About time.
But as expressed above I fear that they will be going after the lowest payed people that do the work. It is really important that the people of New Haven stay informed on what cuts are being made and if they are the appropriate cuts or just cut to appease the people.

It is important for everyone to share this info with everyone in your community. Just because you know and understand the importance of this does not mean everyone does! Share and educate! And when Budget time rolls around again and we ask people to come to the meetings to stand up and be heard YOU HAVE TO COME!!!! It can not be 3-4 people sitting in the room yelling. It can not just be a group fighting for a theater!! I has to be ALL the tax payers of the city saying STOP IT NOW!!!!! You want to see your mill rate go up on top of the next phase in climb??? NO then make sure YOU ARE HEARD THIS YEAR!!! Freezer the phase in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Take care of the residents for a change!!!
Sign up to be on our mailing list so you can get reminders of when the meetings are AND COME TO THEM!!!
http://www.nhcan.org/

Posted by: strangerthanfiction | October 23, 2008 7:32 PM

Cedar Hill you make many good points. But I can't help notice that when it comes to naming specific people that are not needed you're all for it. However, when it comes to naming specific details of what concessions need to be made, you say that the contracts as a whole need to be scrapped. The Mayor has had several opportunities to state clearly what he specifically needs from the unions. Several rounds of job reductions have been made. The unions appear willing to cooperate. So why is he threatening to throw out mutually agreed upon contracts in whole or else??? (they generally come up in mid-2010 anyway). What good can come from this showdown at the O.K. Corral approach? It may make for good political theatre and throw up some red meat for overburdened taxpayers to have a scapegoat. But there's a bullying behind this move by the mayor that I think is beneath him. It's so out of character with the style and policies that have done so much good in lifting up this city.

Posted by: Gary Doyens | October 23, 2008 8:05 PM

Westville Mom:

You are dead right about DeStefano's dismantling the neighborhood school. It is no small thing that Edgewood Magnet is the top or one of the top K-8 schools in the city. It's small. The administration is stable and tough; teachers are excellent and have been there, many of them a long time and most of the kids that attend are from the neighborhood.

But because the state reimbursed at a higher rate for magnet schools; and because DeStefano was chasing PILOT dollars with these schools, the mayor dismantled the neighborhood schools despite experts that according to my sources, told him that was not the thing to do. What you have now, are monster schools, disconnected children.

Under a new mayor, because the investment has been so huge, the best you can hope for, is to break these large schools into smaller versions all under one roof and try to create virtual neighborhood schools without those schools being physically located in the neighborhoods.

Posted by: Steven Ross | October 23, 2008 8:16 PM

Jeffrey Kerekes and Cedar Hill Resident

I am disgusted. What you are proposing is McCarthyism. It didnt work then and it wont work now. There will be lies and inuendos against innocent people at city hall. The problem is at the top for not dealing with underperforming staff.

Posted by: Gary Doyens | October 23, 2008 8:52 PM

Joey:

It is a myth that the unions only represent the lowest wage earners in the city. In fact, you have unions for teachers; a union for city managers, police, fire none of whom are the lowest paid, and sure, the lowest paid - custodians, certain maintenance and public works employees.

Speaking frankly, the only way I'm comfortable, is that the combined weight of the sheer number of city employees (almost 5,000 for a city of 123,000)with benefits, healthcare and pensions is too much. Mayor DeStefano and the financial leadership in this city has known this for years now and they've been warned for years - they ignored it all.

The last round of contracts, which the mayor signed while prostituting himself for governor, gave away too much including minimum staffing levels at the fire department while knowing full well 80 - 85% of the fire department calls were medical, not fire. Did he re-engineer the department for effectiveness/efficiencies? No.

In all, three departments account for the vast majority of general fund expenses - Police, Fire and Education - and the education budget doesn't include ALL the education expenses which are covered in other areas of the budget.

In my humble opinion, having studied this budget for four years, and as part of the Steering Committee of New Haven CAN (New Haven Citizens Action Network), savings can be found in these three budgets if those in charge of these budgets quit being so protective of their overspending; the second tier of cuts should be made in managment of city affairs - consolidating departments where it makes sense and eliminating positions where one can.

It will also require that the city re-focus its mission and eliminate the mission creep that has been the hallmark of DeStefano's nearly two decades in office. For instance, LCI should be cut way back - and should not be changing out smoke detector batteries.

And finally, the mayor's executive staff should be cut. Smuts is smart and talented. He should stay and become the city manager. The city doesn't need a spokesperson nor the other holdover from the campaign. Every department should then become a direct report to Smuts and through him to DeStefano.

Development staff could probably be cut too - a lot of that work is being done by the new development company funded by Yale.

The mayor should then take his own pay down by $10K - He is responsible for this mess just like the titans on Wall Street. If he had any sense of honor and shame, he wouldn't run again and hope that a successor would be able to step in and heal this city. In the meantime, instead of blaming the state, the economy, Wall Street or anybody else - Mayor DeStefano should hold a press conference and apologize to taxpayers and citizens with a heartfelt, no holds barred request for forgiveness for bringing us to this place.

Posted by: steve beck | October 23, 2008 9:15 PM

face it, america is cooked.
read kevin phillips book, american theocracy or bad money. he has hit the nail on the head.
all this angst is worthless.

Posted by: Veryconcerned | October 24, 2008 6:41 AM

Like many of you I am concerned about the financial well-being of our city. I have spoken to many other bright people about this great city and they too are concerned. Some of us would like to put together a coalition to address the problems and solutions as we, citizens see them. Thereafter we will powerfully place our concerns and solutions in front of the current administration. I as many others are serious in our concerns. If you would like to be part of the process please email me at savenewhaven@qmail.com. We have the power to put New Haven in the right direction.

Posted by: jeffreykerekes | October 24, 2008 7:52 AM

What I am calling for is that I am sick of empty accusations. I hear people say, "the mayor is corrupt", there are "mayoral friends getting politically connected jobs", etc... I am sick of hearing rumors without substance. If you know specifics, great! Make your claim. If not, stop spreading rumors based on nothing more than frustrations. It is hard to deal with such issues when you have no details. Accountability is nothing like McCarthyism. I am comfortable calling for such details. With specifics, we have already been able to effectively launch state and federal probes into actions by this administration. That is more than just bellyaching but took facts to get something started. So if you know about something, send it our way.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | October 24, 2008 9:30 AM

First I to am disgusted! When politics began it was to protect the people! I WANT PROTECTION!! No different than a union, city hall is their to work on, not turning New Haven into a Boston tea party! I am greatly disappointed.

strangerthanfiction
Love ya :) Coming from a Union family I do respect unions and know that we truly need them! I think some of the contracts need to be rewritten(rewritten to be with the times)Things are not going to get any better anytime soon. In no way did I mean not to have unions. And the he said she said is that the mayor gave unions a chance and visa versa. Lets do this openly , if need be to clear the air of who turned down what. And saying the unions are red meat for the "game" of New Haven politics may be true. But lets be real a few of the union used the voting pull and power to push the city into agreeing to some above the norm things. (And I am not saying all unions)

Joey nardo contact NHCAN with specifics please

Westville Mom and Gary I agree to. I think the dismantling of the small schools caused a lot of problems in different areas. It took away the village aspect of communities. It kept neighbors from talking to neighbors, not to mention the education aspects.

"JANE DOE"!!!!! MY god please find out who this is and get rid of her!!

"Analyze This" What Jeffery did was open the door to looking at possibility's of things that can be cut. It was more of a statement that their are alot of wasteful small thing that can add up to larger dollar amounts!! Did you even bother to take time out of your life to try to fight this mess?? Really I did not see anyone at the budget meetings but the same few people. Can I ask what steps you have taken to STOP THIS MESS??

and gary I do agree I think Smuts is a keeper.

Veryconcerned can you contact NHCAN and have your group work with this one to. http://www.nhcan.org/

Posted by: accountable | October 24, 2008 9:55 AM

Let me start by saying there are a lot of good points being brought to light here. And for the record I am a city employed Union worker. And Mr. Doyens is right all Union workers are not equal and the groups he mentions custodians, DPW are the lower paid Union employees. And yes the Mayor did prostitute himself while running for governor; unfortunately the same lower paid Union employees were not the benefactors of his governors run. Hey not every Union worker is a good worker it is no different then any other place of employment. Again the managers would rather beat on the good employees then deal with the bad. This of course demoralizes the production of the good employee. As Joey Nardo pointed out that in a year or two managers will out number actual working employees. This is what Steve Ross pointed out the top and middle are under performing. The B.O.E is paying an outsource company AFB formally Aramark to manage the managers. Let us not forget this was the case in food service. Aramark is out and the kids are eating better then before. So why did the Unions have to bring this to light did the high paid department heads not see this? Very simple if a worker is not doing his/her work then a manager needs to deal with that employee. If not then the highly paid department heads should deal with the manager's plane and simple right. No the answer is lets higher a company so we do not have to be accountable for the mess. Again some Unions have been willing to try and help but not all.And as stranger then fiction pointed out nothing good would come out of the showdown at OK corral approach I agree. Unfortunately I think the Mayor is feeling his oats and wants a fight on his hands.This what I think his press conference should have been simple fix. Regardless of what department or weather you are Unionized employee or not all 5,000 employees will equally give a concession based on the individuals income and it will start with me first.

Posted by: Gary Doyens | October 24, 2008 10:35 AM

Accountable:

We pay companies and consultants to manage the managers????? You have to be kidding me.

Posted by: Gary Doyens | October 24, 2008 10:56 AM

This should be a wake up call:

City of Winston Salem: 223,000 citizens
City Employment: 2,300
City Police Officers: 514 sworn

City of New Haven: 123,000 citizens
City Employment: 4,980
City Police Officers: 400 + or -

Posted by: Tired of the mayor! | October 24, 2008 12:19 PM

Are the kids really eating better than before?
This program cost millions and is costing millions and maybe even more this year. The key is not let mayor fool you. Exsample, He knew that this progam was in trouble a long time ago this (years ago). All of a sudden he thru out Aramark out. He did'nt care for 12 years.

He fooled unions by making them believed he cared about them, knowing fully what a financial diaster he created. Now he trying to fool you again and blame the state and country financial situation on the citys financial mess!!

Please don't be fooled he knew this awhile ago!!

He has mismanage all funds for years and years!! WE NEED AUDITS!!

Posted by: Gary Doyens | October 24, 2008 1:18 PM

Other interesting facts about Winston Salem -

Alders: 8 not the 30 you have in New Haven.

Online: Every department of Winston Salem is accessed on line; you can buy building permits to yard waste collection containers on line without special additional fees; without leaving your home.

All meeting notices are online and all routine meetings are clearly noted.

The police department is fully on line with neighborhood crime stats; community stats, results of internal investigations etc.

Amazing how streamlined it all is.

Posted by: Cough Cough | October 24, 2008 2:13 PM

Gary Doyens

Winston Salem has a booming economy. Even in recessions or depressions people keep puffing and puffing.

If you are going to provide comparisons do like for like please compare New Haven with Bridgeport, Waterbury or Hartford. Include New London and Norwalk if you wish.

Another thought. How about Providence. It has an ivy league college not paying taxs.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | October 24, 2008 2:26 PM

Tired of the mayor!

Ya no what...Don't under estimate people. I really think no one is being fooled any more. The jig is up. Tax payers are about to see the 3rd phase in increase. And he has yet to address that even once!! Please know that most have seen the light. Obama has done more than what he thinks he has. He has let people know it is all about the people and if we stand together change can happen....watch what happens.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | October 24, 2008 2:27 PM

Winston Salem hmmmm I wonder if my boss will let me work via internet.

Posted by: Tired of the mayor! | October 24, 2008 2:36 PM

cedarhillresident

Glad to hear that. Can't take another term.

Posted by: Gary Doyens | October 24, 2008 5:53 PM

Cough, Cough:

I just love it when people make comments before they investigate. The economy in Winston has been hit like everywhere, especially banking, and cough, cough, tobacco. RJ Reynolds got absorded years ago and has long moved out of the city. Even their state of the art manufacturing is not done at their plant there anymore.

They have invested heavily in technology and the whole city operates on line. It's a good lesson to us who operate via paper and in the dark ages.
They've achieved a lot of efficiencies that way. And by the way, the demographics are very similar - median income is $37K; large ethnic population; sizeable and continuing challenges on housing and poverty.

And by the way...why on earth would we want to compare ourselves to other CT cities who are managed so poorly? If you set the bar low enough, even New Haven will look like a garden spot of government ingenuity. Give me a break. That's exactly what DeStefano has been doing for years - comparing himself to the worst managed cities on earth and say, hey, we're better than them. What kind of benchmark is that?

Posted by: Gary Doyens | October 24, 2008 11:35 PM

oh...and Winston Salem doesn't have one university..it has several. Wake Forest University; Winston Salem State University; a community college and a drama school. It is also home to a myriad of non-profits funded by, you guessed it tobacco, furniture and underwear heirs. Two major hospital complexes and a med school tied to Wake Forest. There are a lot of similarities. Perhaps we should accept that and see if we can't follow their example.

Posted by: Sandra Oconner | October 25, 2008 12:16 AM

I am wondering why is Mayor Destefano not giving back his raise ? He wants for everyone else to give up some of their salary. Why is he not giving up some of his ? Why is he not the example to the tax payers that he is supposed to be representing ? He wants the unions to give up the raises that the union members are already enjoying at this moment but he is not willing to give up his. All talk but no action on his part.
He wants everyone else to make sacrifices but he is not willing or will not sacrifice himself. He wants to make his cake and eat it too. He needs to get off from that cloud and come to reality. If you want the citizens of New Haven to give up some of their salaries or to make sacrifices then you Mr Mayor Destefano start by being the example to the people that you are supposed to be representing and you give "UP SOME OF YOUR RAISE"

Posted by: SANDRA OCONNOR | October 25, 2008 12:25 AM

This message is for "JANE DOE"
For the life of me I can not understand what went through you mind to post such a comment. The comment that you posted on october 23, 2008 at 0746 am about not caring about the children that you teach is completely out of line. You are a disgrace to your profession and should be fired on the spot. It seems that your heart is not in your job. Please quit and put yourself out of your misery if it is so much of a burden for you to teach our children. Someone else that has truly the dedication and love to teach children can use your present spot. That was really a very ignorant comment on your part to post on this site.

Posted by: teachergal | October 25, 2008 8:22 AM

OOPs..sorry about that pressed the wrong key...

Lowering the retirement age would also be a good way to save money. Believe me there are many who are ready to move on in their lives but are trapped and have to stay because of the 37 years in clause. I love the kids but reality says it may be time for me to go in a few more years and i would not be close to 37 years. Do i need my full retirement? "You betcha!"

Lastly, as a teacher who has taught in a magnet school and a non magnet school let me say that their are many inequities. What is fair about a magnet school having a budget for field trips, supplies, etc. and a non magnet school not even having enough money to buy pencils and books? The kids know it and so do the teachers and it is not fair!

Posted by: Catch 22 | October 25, 2008 10:55 AM

Ex Governor John Rowland had budget cuts in 2002 and laid off many state workers. Some of them disgruntled people snitched on him and he was indited, tried and put in prison.

This is obviously not the reason that Johnny Boy is trying to cut union salaries and benefits to avoid layoffs. It is payback for there lack of suppoert wen he ran for governor.

I cant see the unions folding. They will take the layoffs. We will get less services. Next year I expect my property tax to go up 15% with the phase in. I dont know how I will be able to get by.

Posted by: robn | October 25, 2008 11:52 AM

GD,

Thanks for the stats. I've tried really hard, but to no avail, to find historical city employee-to-resident ratios for small US cities . I think that to judge effectively, we need a lot more comparisons becuase of the many subtle, but significant differences in cities.

Theres a lot of govt data available...its just difficult to sift through...

to make it even more difficult, over the past 30 years the right wing has pushed privitization of everything possible and its hard to tell how many personel may have been displaced by outsourcing.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | October 25, 2008 8:30 PM

teachergal

My kids went to hooker...many years ago when the magnet trend started. I remember the school fighting so hard not to become a magnet, were parents had to donate things to just keep the school afloat. Now keep in mind that many in the school were out of district so that was not the reasoning behind it. It was to keep the school what it was a simple and loving p;ace to learn. By the life of me I will never get why magnets get money and non magnets don't! What happened to educating our children the basic things. Hillhouse back when my dad was growing up did not just have teachers it had Professors! You left high school knowing chemistry as a basic not just a class for the special!! What is the problem! Time to stop the FREAKIN politics in the class room! that is what magnets are and that is now what is failing our school system and the cost of education!

Posted by: It takes a village | October 26, 2008 12:43 PM

Edgewood is a magnet school that gives preference to siblings and neighborhood children.It began as a neighborhood school,but as more of the westville parents chose to send their children to private or parochial schools the district expanded to the other side of Edgewood park.The school became more diverse racially and economically.As a way to gain extra funding they applied for magnet funding as a h.o.t. school with an arts based curriculum.This then drew interest from some of the westville parents who were previously pulling their children out.they now want a neighborhood based school.Their scores are higher because the enrollment is very selective,not because they are a true magnet lottery drawing kids of all abilities and providing the supportive services that are needed.The higher numbers of children in talented and gifted programs versus special ed does not reflect the numbers at other schools,not because the teachers are necessarily better,but because many westville children come from homes that have two parent, professionally educated parents in one family homes.They are not witnessing the same levels of crime and violence(thank goodness)that many children citywide are.When schools are truly equal we can then bring back neighborhood schools. As a westville parent,I choose to send my children across town to a public school where they will be in a diverse environment and they will each get the educational programs that fit their needs.I only hope that one day our neighborhood schools will provide this same diversity that exists in our city without the long busrides.Westville can and should redistrict with Davis,Sheridan,Edgewood,Beecher,Katherine Brennan and Barnard without having to shut down schools in more densely populated areas of New Haven.How about it Mayor DeStefano?

Posted by: Westville Mom | October 26, 2008 5:40 PM

Cedar Hill, it's great! to see that you (a liberal) and I (a conservative) can agree on something. I disagree, however, with ITAV that Edgewood kids are achieving only because of their home advantages. I would say instead that other kids are failing because of deficiencies in the schools. I would strongly urge all to read this article from last week in US News & W. R.: "Brownsville Schools Win Prestigious Award"
http://www.usnews.com/articles/education/k-12/2008/10/14/brownsville-schools-win-prestigious-award.html
Brownsville, TX is larger than New Haven and has the highest child poverty rate in the entire country. Being on the Mexico border, it has a high percentage of recent immigrants with no English. If you read this, you will not BELIEVE what they are accomplishing there. There are concrete ideas in this article and they are not revolutionary.
I also don't see why we can't have neighborhood schools with the OPTION of going out of district, if one chooses. It's done in other places. What New Haven is doing is shooting itself in the foot (pardon the metaphor.) IF we had a low crime rate AND neighborhood schools, we would have been perfectly positioned to take advantage of the gas & financial crisis right now by attracting middle-income people back to the city. It is happening in lots of other cities---a return to short commutes. Almost no one, however, wants to gamble their mortgage and their children on a SCHOOL LOTTERY. (Edgewd., btw, is only guaranteed if you are applying for Kinderg. because higher grades are filled up.) My child's rejection letter (for 1st gr.) of Mar.2000 reads,"There were approx. 4000 applicants and only 1,670 seats." I didn't apply for any other schools.
This (stale) Dem. adm. has been fixated on social engineering that doesn't work, but he (and THEY, the aldermen) will continue to get reelected-- & with the whole darn govt. going Dem., get ready to have more of the same old same old.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | October 26, 2008 6:54 PM

Westville Mom

I don't buy into the whole thing that village stated. When was that? If I am correct that was when private schools where all part of being one of the Jone's. It was part of middle class society, I am not so sure how the quality of the schools really played into the decisions of going private at that time or of it was indicator of your status. And again I am using me as an example to dispute Village statement that low income has anything to do with education. I was well in the poverty level while raising my kids. This was the biggest push for them to do good in school. THEY HAD NO CHOOSE!! Period. Latch key kids while I worked two jobs. But I let them know they could not let me down. Period! OK I am going to get shot for this statement. We (society) allowed this to happen. When I grew up my job was school, my kids job was school. their was no if and's or but's. Now we have allowed people to use excuse as a way out. I am poor, my parents did not care, society is injust...the list goes on. And parents now use these excuses on getting out of being parents and teachers use these excuses (as Jane Doe showed above). So the crap! Children's jobs are to get an education period! Go back to small community schools! Where kids where not numbers. Where neighbors met in the am and chatted about what was going on in the area. Where you said...I saw your kid doing this or that. That is what a VILLAGE IS. Watch how crime will drop to. When neighbors become neighbors again. hmm sorry I rambled. :) (as usual)

Posted by: It takes a village | October 26, 2008 9:22 PM

I live in Westville and I see neighborhood parents including myself who have children who need help in school not able to get into Edgewood,and schools across town willing to provide that help.I also know people from out of district(other areas of westville) with bright kids able to get 2-3 siblings at a time accepted while their are waiting lists for neighborhood children.My point is the teachers should not get all the credit for the high scores when the acceptance process is clearly selective.Kids all over town are being educated by teachers and students working just as hard,sometimes both facing greater challenges.I may have not worded it right,but I am not putting down low income families as I am one myself and I too teach my kids the value of education and try to stay active in their schools.I still was responding to Gary Doyens remarks giving Edgewood as an example of a top K-8 school,when there are many other schools just as good in New Haven being closed.

Posted by: FIX THE SCHOOLS | October 27, 2008 8:43 AM

Interesting debate on what amounts to an issue of school quality. CedarHill, expecting people to be as responsible as you were (are) only gets you so much. Yes, we need higher expectations of parents and students, but if we are to turn the tide on generational poverty, we really need much better outcomes from our public schools (read: elected leaders). Sadly they know how to do this, but they don't want to alienate political allies. They choose to favor the adults who work in the system over the children and families who are trapped in it.

As long as there are schools out there, be they private, parochial and yes, charter, which are turning low performing kids into great scholars, we need to grow, replicate, gain access to as many of these schools as possible and as quickly as possible.

Great schools are found in many shapes and forms. Demand more schools like these.

Posted by: Disgruntled Democrat | October 27, 2008 10:03 AM

There is crime at Edgewood, it just goes unreported. When one of my children attended there, in a span of three weeks a lunchbox and a jacket were stolen. When we confronted the principal about this, she told us that it would be reviewed, but when we checked back, we found that no report was created for either event.

Other parents, when not in a group, will tell you the same thing. It is not PC to speak poorly of our local school, so no one does it when others are around.

The reason that there are high scores at the school is because of volunteers coming in prior to the mastery tests to tutor the kids. Parent volunteers are discouraged at other times and some parents have been told to stay away from the school altogether.

The racial diversity at Edgewood is not indicative of the neighborhood, and maybe not even of New Haven, and how neighborhood children cannot attend there due to a lottery system is beyond me.

As far as the T.A.G. program, only two students per class are allowed to be in the program, meaning four per grade are considered talented and gifted. This program is only for approximately 90 minutes per week, so what if any good is coming from it.

The entire BOA needs to be restructured, with waste eliminated and the financial resources (of which there are plenty) aimed at the students, not the members of the union, especially the top heavy administration, so that these children are better prepared for life. There must be HR cuts from the BOA and that money applied to childrens' programs, whether it be after school programs, new text books or other learning materials, etc.

When there are 5 assistant principals in one school, that costs the tax payers over five hundred thousand dollars currently, and that doesn't include the future pension and health benefits. There is no reason to have more than one principal and one assistant principal in each school. How much waste is going to be tolerated while our children sit bored in a classroom? How many books and resources could be purchased with the exact same money that is wasted on extra personnel?

We will not have the current funding next year, or in the years to come, so the only manner in which education is going to improve is by "redistributing the wealth." Take from the wealthy administrators and give to the students.

Posted by: teachergal | October 28, 2008 9:30 AM

Disgruntled Democrat:

Re: Crime. I had to lock everything from my desk into my drawers as each day i found one thing gone, tape, stapler, pens, etc.

Re: Top down cuts, now your talking my language. Get rid of all the admins and coaches and see how much money you'll save. I can't tell you how many paid personnel are walking around doing a lot of nothing, IMHO. We have coaches for everything in addition to Principals and Vice principals and Curriculum Experts! And, the funny thing is all these experts are between 30 - 40 years of age, having spent 10 or less years in a classroom.

We recently had a bunch of "suits" walking around our building. "Cambridge" consultants who judge your school periodically throughout the year. How can we affort to pay for them? I would love to know how much that is costing the city per year. Maybe it's a grant but guess what? those will soon be dried up also. Let's put our money to better use, more teachers, smaller class size, and neighborhood schools that teach all of our children not just a select few that make it through the lottery. It's an insult to the rest!

Lastly, to all of you who think "magnet schools" are the answer. I worked in one for many years and i saw kids who were accepted that were problem kids of the worst kind. The magnet was their last chance and believe me they were not making the most of it. They were rude and disruptive the majority of the time. Why do we think this is helping kids! It's not but it is giving new haven extra monies to use as they wish.

Signing off,TG