New Haven Independent

Posted by: leroy | February 25, 2009 8:55 AM

it's all ghetto anyway.wish i could afford to move

Posted by: Nan Bartow | February 25, 2009 10:09 AM

I am horrified by Sam's Food Stores and Altaf's irresponsible attitude towards their new acquisition, the Beaver Hill Shopping Center. Why would they spend a million and a half dollars to buy it and then leave the shopping center looking like a trashy wreck? Shame!! Shame!! Shame!!

Posted by: TMB | February 25, 2009 11:10 AM

I love that putting up a new sign is considered "a big investment on our part." HELLOOO Mr Altaf, I would expect that a return on that "big investment" should also be your goal. Nothing can ruin a business like a neighborhood that boycotts it. Make it more appealing and everyone wins.

Posted by: john john | February 25, 2009 11:46 AM

If the Livable City Initiative was a real authority with any teeth, this place would have been bulldozed along with it's neighbor, Harry's Package.
The gas station kitty corner aint' a tourist spot either.

Posted by: FairHavenResToo | February 25, 2009 12:16 PM

But John John, who gets to decide when private property should be bulldozed? I agree that this place could use some work, but I as a private citizen do not want the LCI to have 'teeth' to decide something like that about my private property. At what point would it stop?
Food for thought.

Posted by: john john | February 25, 2009 1:03 PM

Fairhaven, the LCI should give an immediate order to clean up (windows, graffiti, awnnings, parking lot, paint. ect) like 30 days, then put to a public hearing if the spot should be 86'd. Give the public, the LCI and the owners a chance to get their say, then have some kind of board - 5-7 people with maybe only ONE of them appointed by the mayor, decide the fate. We do it with everything else. Then maybe all of the other out of town slumlords will put some money and effort into getting thier properties in shape.
The city wants to fine everyone for parking, not shoveling snow and whatnot, let's fine people for being disrespectful and filthy with their unchecked property.

Posted by: Our Town | February 25, 2009 1:21 PM

The Sam's at Whalley and Sherman isn't exactly a Trump property either. I wouldn't expect much better elsewhere.

Posted by: norton street | February 25, 2009 1:30 PM

fitch and blake's future prosperity isnt dependent on a few fix ups, its on a complete overhaul. the reason this corner sucks is because its designed around the automobile aka the neighborhood killer. the gas station has to go, the beaver hill shopping center has to go and new building that replaced harrys package store needs to be turned 90 degrees to butt up against the sidewalk on fitch street. the corner needs 3-4 story mixed use retail/apartment buildings, with minimal parking (10 spots total for the entire corner), there needs to be bike racks and green spaces instead of asphalt. its a matter of poor design. graffiti is a cop out, something used to explain why an area is bad, that idea is just ridiculous, a little spray paint isnt so bad, its the design of the plaza thats terrible.

ITS NOT A NIEGHBORHOOD PLAZA IF THERES A PARKING LOT. NEIGHBORS DONT USE CARS TO GO TO THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD STORES THEY WALK. ITS A CITY. THE F*&K OUT OF YOUR CARS.

Posted by: jawbone | February 25, 2009 1:40 PM

It should stay. If Hollywood ever rolls into town again to shoot, say, a b-grade horror flick, this plaza would make a great movie set.
Sorta like the abandoned shopping mall in Monroeville, PA that George Romero used for shooting 'Dawn of the Dead'.

Posted by: What? | February 25, 2009 3:42 PM

OT, I'm shocked. I thought the Sam's on Whalley and Sherman was an apothecary since all I ever see being purchased there is drugs. Maybe they just need to expand to new territory. I'm sure the 'patients' that shop there don't care what the place looks like.

Posted by: eli | February 25, 2009 4:10 PM

Norton St., you and your pious bicycles or die ilk just don't get it.
Whalley pizza's plaza doesn't have parking spots, edge of the woods does. Zanes' cycles has parking spots, the little plaza where whalley hardware doesn't. I live six blocks away from my local urban plaza, and if it's under 40 degrees, dark or hinting of rain, i drive my car, my big beautiful car.
If it's a plaza designed for use of the local people (like no wal-marts, no best buys, no big box), then it's a neighborhood plaza. i want my enighborhood plaza to have available to me, in order -a cold six pack - milk - the new york times - bread -a pack of smokes - some kind of food- no homeless/ stick up guys - parking - cleanliness.
if it's ugly, a place to buy dime bags or has had more than one shooting in the last 3 years, it's a crappy neighborhood plaza that needs to be demolished, and if a better tennant can't be found, it should be turned into a green space, which in turn should be kept up by the city and neighbors.

Posted by: Pat | February 25, 2009 4:54 PM

sometimes ghetto store owners do not have money to keep the ghetto from effecting their property. Your heart almost goes out to them. I mean replacing plexiglass is cheaper than replacing glass and how many times can you wash off graffiti. One cannot always have eye candy for strip malls. We are not in Greenwich after all. hee,hee,hee

Posted by: norton street | February 25, 2009 8:24 PM

eli, edge of the woods is fine, its the stores across the street that are designed horribly. that parking lot shout be a plaza/green space, not an asphalt piece of crap.

Posted by: Streever | February 26, 2009 11:04 AM

Nice work Jim! I hope you can get some results out there.

Norton Street,
yes, it'd be great if that area was better designed: I can see some practical value though in driving there--even if you live nearby--and loading the car up. I think you're right that an over-dependence on automobiles can harm a neighborhood, but let's keep in mind too that it definitely does change one's life to not have a car. I've been car-free for about 5 years or so now, and it transforms simple things like washing my clothes into a 2 hour process, instead of a 30 minute one.

I don't personally use a car, but I do see the practical value to car ownership & usage--that being said, you have some excellent points about bike access & improving the walkability of that neighborhood. Let's just make sure that we don't leave behind those who own cars, many of whom may not have the economic lifestyle that makes a walk/bike existence easier. If you work min. wage the ability to go to the store & buy a lot of food & the ability to do laundry/other tasks in bulk saves you substantial time in your week.

Posted by: nfjanette | February 26, 2009 1:49 PM

eli, edge of the woods is fine, its the stores across the street that are designed horribly. that parking lot shout be a plaza/green space, not an asphalt piece of crap.

If it was a plaza/green space, it would front abandoned, failed businesses. Then, you could make even more plaza/green space and be even happier. BTW, who will be paying for your all-green vision? You?

Posted by: Zach | February 26, 2009 2:26 PM

Look...guys.... the reason that the new owners will not put money into the property is because they simply do not want. they want to make as much money as possible and spend as little money as possible. the new owners are obviously socially irresponsible to the neighborhood and its residents and all they want to do is make money. so this is what to do.... stop shopping there. if all the new owners are after is the peoples money, stop giving them your money. then the business owners will leave and the plaza will become vacant. then how are these new owners goin to make money if they have no tenants? also, residents should influence the business owners to move to a new location. it all up to you guys... just get it done.

Posted by: Oh my goodness?!!! | February 26, 2009 2:40 PM

... I can see some practical value though in driving there--even if you live nearby--and loading the car up. I think you're right that an over-dependence on automobiles can harm a neighborhood, but let's keep in mind too that it definitely does change one's life to not have a car....

I never thought I'd see the day where a support for cars would come from the mouth of Streever! Anybody know where I can get some 'end of the world' or 'snowball in hell' insurance because something is surely about to happen! ;)

Posted by: concerned | February 26, 2009 5:52 PM

I thought commercial property was part of the health departments responsibility, why are we beating up LCI?

Posted by: norton street | February 26, 2009 8:32 PM

Here is what the shopping center looks like today:
http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=41.327439,-72.953317&spn=0,359.972105&t=h&z=16&layer=c&cbll=41.327481,-72.953212&panoid=yAad6S5AUfFp57y701XE5A&cbp=12,114.93972123200054,,0,1.6769230769230803

Here is what 30 minutes of design can make it look like:
http://photos-a.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-snc1/v2479/220/6/1085910074/n1085910074_30144136_4457525.jpg

Nfjanette, i am currently working on creating a city-wide design project that presents possible design plans for over 20 vacant/underused lots in the city, with more being added everyday. I plan on sending this to the city's planning commission within the next year, and hopefully when i get out of school i will be hired to build some of my designs, which focus on walkable city streets with human scale buildings.

Posted by: Beverville Resident | February 27, 2009 9:02 AM

Leroy, I think ...you should become more involed instead of just driving in and out and complianing about everything. If you were involved you would take ownership annd feel pride everytime you drove and/or walked you area of New Haven

Posted by: leroy | February 27, 2009 9:31 AM

to pat,indeed beaverhill is not greenwich but the trash,graffiti,drug dealing and general scumbaggism is not tolerated in any city south of west haven. nobody would claim these peoples civil right were violated and march on a sub station that is hanging on by a thread.seems new haveners except their situation and things are only going downhill.reguarding hollywood coming to film a movie here how about calling it Down and Out in Beaver Hill!

Posted by: leroy | February 27, 2009 9:37 AM

to beaverhill resident,i live on blake street.i see the garbage up & down everyday.i have never shoppred in any of those stores,orgered chinese take out once and threw it out.

Posted by: burt | February 27, 2009 10:05 AM

i go to school here and can't wait to go back to redding this summer.i think the blicks are eyesores and were developed totally wrong years ago and won't ever be fixed.

Posted by: norton street | February 27, 2009 12:43 PM

burt, please go back to redding and never return. that disgusting slum doesnt even have sidewalks, at least bever hills is a community!

Posted by: Streever | February 27, 2009 1:28 PM

Oh my goodness?!!!:
I've always characterized my personal decision to live without a car as just that :). If someone asks me if I think it's a good idea, I say "Yes!" but I've definitely never advocated any anti-car directions ;-). I think cars are useful tools, especially for people who live beneath the poverty line & see their time/energy sucked up in mundane tasks.

That doesn't mean I don't make fun of my friends who drive from East Rock into downtown for work though! They are my friends, it's the least I can do to make them feel good about themselves. Anytime you drive 15 minutes in congested traffic to avoid a 15 minute walk & then spend 5 minutes trying to find parking in an area without much parking, well, that's just silly, isn't it?

Posted by: Court | February 27, 2009 7:28 PM

It speakes volumes that the self important cyber-intelligensia of new haven are so self involved and critical ofthings like a crappy street plaza in westville or some recovering people trying to expres themselves downtown (the "slave play") - and i'm talking directly to you alphonse -that they can afford to blabber about appearances and the most extraenous and aesthetic issues in life.
Those of us in the real world are worried about rent/ mortgage, how are we going to afford heat, insurance, energy, will i still have a job next month, do i have anything left in my retirement fund? Real life.
This plaza is clearly a (my own edit, because i know first hand the independent doesn't properly give notation when they edit) a freaking s&^%hole. I drive by it everyday, and hope there's been a fire (afer hours of course) that has destroyed the entire complex. If i had my druthers, the residents would show up with pitchforks and torches to demand a better string of stores. In my dream they would also not shop there, and instead, go to a plaza that gave a damned about it's appearnace. However , it aint a possiblility. We don't all have the luxury of cars, and some of us need to shop where we can walk at 815pm. Mr. streever CHOOSES to not drive, many of the "green" (and i bet at least 90%+ caucasion) community think there should be minimal parking. That is insensitive, and i'm sick and tired of the self-righteous yelling foul everytime a project gives any kind of acknowledgment to the almighty car.
In my perfect world, this place would be stricken from the earth, and a kid's park with swings and a slide and no homeless or crackheads would flourish. It aint gonna happen, because the neighbors don't take the greatest of care (have you SEEN the houses between blake and Schwartz hall? they are third world at best.
This neighborhood, nay, all of the northwestern wards have become not only eyesores, but an embarrasing reminder of what we're donig wrong.
Drive up valley st., check out the abandoned brookside housing projects, hell, look at SCSU - it's all dirt and temporary fences and walkways.
Nevermind, i'm just going to cut my losses and move to branford.

Posted by: walt bradley | February 27, 2009 11:58 PM

I'm right behind you Court, New Haven is a sucker bet with sucker in charge and a full slate of yes men on the BOA. Oops, i mean Douchebag in charge.

Posted by: norton street | February 28, 2009 3:13 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1ZeXnmDZMQ&feature=channel_page

http://www.tv-links.eu/show_link.php?data=MzEwNDc%3D

watch the documentary "New Urban Cowboy"

read:
"City: Urbanism and its End"

anything on urbanism, pedestrianism, learn, be a human and learn.

Pick up a book, do any amount of research, use your eyes and look around. You have a brain, use it. If you can find one book or article that speaks about a bright future with automobiles send it my way and i'll read it and think about it.

Posted by: burt | March 2, 2009 8:58 AM

reply to norton street,my parents own a 4 bedroom colonial in redding .far from the "slum" u describe it as.they actually have an association that gets on your back if you lawn isn't cut,snow is removed timely and the homes are maintained.
have you ever been off norton st?

Posted by: norton street | March 2, 2009 12:15 PM

grass is the most uneconomical planting in existence. it requires frequent trimming, generally with gas powered mowers. large areas of grass are not ideal.

theres more diversity on one block on my street then there is in the entire town of redding. and ive spent summers in baltimore and philadelphia and right now im not even in new haven, im away at school trying to get the skills i need to fix this mess the generation before me created. the days of extravagance are coming to an end. you can bet ill be back on norton street this summer and for as many years as it takes to get everyone who ran out the suburbs back into the city.

Posted by: burt | March 2, 2009 3:31 PM

to norton st
and maybe if you wish real hard the stegosaurus statue on whitney ave will come to life and we'll all be in dinotopia! although i don't know how we'll feed her if the economics of grass is tabled.maybe she'll develop a taste for bad pizza & chinese takeout down at the beaver hill shopping center where this all started.

Posted by: oldschool | March 9, 2009 9:32 PM

That area used to be so nice -I'm glad I had the opportunity to grow up in that area to see it in it's hayday.

Posted by: Arsalan Altaf | March 30, 2009 3:11 PM

This is what it is. You guys make it out to be such a big deal. Well if you do not like that area then move out. I do not have time to waste ignorant people who choose to critisize. At the end of the day it is all about our interest and not yours. Its business so deal with it!