New Haven Independent

Posted by: nfjanette | April 20, 2009 4:48 PM

That means the main entrance for drivers to the city will be from Long Wharf across the bridge to Church Street South instead of the Route 34 Connector, DeStefano said. He said construction on Interstate 95 in the area of the Route 34 exit ramp will make traffic there "no place to be."

I can almost see the rejoicing from some already on the pages of NHI, but this is a foolish hand waving over a major impediment to anyone entering or leaving the city. And, despite the claims otherwise, New Haven needs to be an attractive destination for work and recreation for the region. The city cannot self-sustain, as the high taxes show all too well. I hope this plan "works", but I fear the cost on many levels may be higher than people realize at first.

Posted by: anon | April 20, 2009 4:55 PM

Great news. When will construction begin? Can CGA hurry up and deed the land already?

Posted by: -- | April 20, 2009 5:09 PM

nfjeanette, I understand your concerns, but does it not reassure you a little bit that a major developer whose success relies precisely on the factors you cite is in fact the engine behind this project?
If Carter Winstanley were concerned that his multimillion dollar investment in the city would be damaged by transforming the transportation grid, I might be a little more worried, but it looks like this project isn't going to make downtown more difficult to reach from the highway, since there is going to be major upgrading of many other streets, not the least of which is Church street south. The combination of north and south frontage plus an upgraded church street south should definitely help with the traffic.

Posted by: Our Town | April 20, 2009 5:18 PM

It's sad that the mayor and his apple polishers think this is a good idea...Certainly YNHH must know how this will curtail access to the hospital, particularly emergency access.

There is no plan for the rerouting of the existing traffic on the road...to say it will use the Church St. Ext. is not only ludicrous, it's laughable. I might be able to support this when someone tells me where the existing traffic will be accommodated, and don't say on a trolley or other transit, because that's not part of this plan.

Posted by: anon | April 20, 2009 5:20 PM

Our Town, a lot more traffic can be accommodated on a low-speed urban boulevard than on a high-speed highway like Route 34. Reason? The cars can be closer together. Optimum speed for traffic flow is around 25MPH, not 55.

Posted by: norton street | April 20, 2009 5:36 PM

along the entire route 34 highway from the boulevard to union ave/state street this city needs to rediscover the courtyard, park and plaza, as well as human scale buildings (no taller than 10 stories-although 7 is the max number of stories someone can walk up using stairs) so that people will have the ability to raise families in downtown new haven. mass transit and density is the key to life in the future where energy is much more expensive due to china's middle class demanding of growth just as america did almost a century ago and modest lifestyles are no longer just an option but requirement. the individual automobile has little place in the urban environment (ex: air rights garage, temple street garage, 45% of downtown new haven's square footage dedicated to parking, impossible to safely cross streets, etc.). parking garages will be converted into housing and places of work in the future, just as old factories are being converted today.
this is a step in the right direction, but something really needs to be down with north and south frontage roads, theyre really terrible. maybe we'll see the reemergence of oak street.

as a side note, that parking garage on winchester and munson is truly awful, one of most disgusting things ever. that factory building that was there had infinitely better character than this monstrosity. hopefully this is not the type of "development" we will continue to receive.

Posted by: fedupwithliberals | April 20, 2009 6:02 PM

So, its gonna take an ambulance 15 minutes longer to get to the hospital traveling through the congested city instead of the Rt 34 connector? Great idea! Another reason to move out. And I wonder what construction company will benefit from this project?

Posted by: Esbe | April 20, 2009 6:07 PM

That means the main entrance for drivers to the city will be from Long Wharf across the bridge to Church Street South instead of the Route 34 Connector, DeStefano said. He said construction on Interstate 95 in the area of the Route 34 exit ramp will make traffic there "no place to be."

Is NFJ misinterpreting this remark? Is it this project that will render route 34 unusable for awhile, or it is "construction on I-95"? It is not really very clear, the quote seems to say two contradictory things. Once the various construction projects are done, it will still be possible to exit onto Route 34 and head onto frontage road.

I agree that the enthusiasm of the local (very large) employers (Winstanley, YNHH, the Med School) implies that they think the traffic flow will be just fine, and they have the best incentive to figure it out (and the $$s to hire actual traffic engineers.)

Posted by: anon | April 20, 2009 6:10 PM

Norton Street is spot on as always. If people think that our current economy of 2500SF particle board homes, large SUVs is sustainable, they have another thing coming. Not to mention the wide streets. ConnDOT's plans for Route 34 and 4-lane-WHalley Ave were drawn up in the 1980s and somehow haven't changed since. Whalley ave is about to go into construction and now is the time to stop it and save the city if we want to have an inhabitable, walkable and healthy place to live, rather than a blighted town with the equivalent of a high speed freeway running through it.

hopefully we can at least do better with Route 34, although the plans for the sections west of WInstanley's project don't seem that promising. They just expand parking, and create high speed one way streets with parking only on one side (if anyone is even willing to trust their car there), which will c reate more traffic, even more parking, wider streets in the long term. All in order to supposely create a few jobs at a strip mall office park, even though the research shows jobs and resources go to the places that are pleasant, healthy and walkable (like orange or state street in new haven), while strip malls go vacant.

Also better get those trolleys, expanded rail facilities and affordable housing in place soon because the crisis is only going to get worse.

Winstanley is to be commended because he is going to be making a lot of money while helping to bring density and jobs back to the center of new Haven. Good for him to invest in a sustainable community rather than try to do more big box retail.

It's nice Rosa is giving New Haven $5 million to do a study on Route 34 but how come she just gave Branford $80 million to expand a totally unneccessary, local bridge on route 1 that will just create more traffic? I could think of 100 places in NH County that needed the money more than that.

Posted by: anon | April 20, 2009 6:11 PM

Esbe, Winstanley has had a traffic engineer working on this project for at least 3 years now.

Posted by: norton street | April 20, 2009 8:05 PM

FUWL,
yes, if people continue to crowd this city with cars then it will take an ambulance a long time to get to the hospital. but if we fight for expanded/better mass transit that people commit to using then an ambulance will get to the hospital faster then ever before.

if humans ever evolve into massive 2000lb boxes of metal and glass then this country would be great. it would be perfectly proportioned and scaled with the right amount of infrastructure. but until that happens, we need to design everything around the human being. that means designing sidewalks to accommodate for the human way of travel aka walking. we should design streets to accommodate for vehicular travel of 15-25mph (the speed at which a grown up has a high percentage chance of surviving a collision) --bike lanes, small engine automobile and bus lanes. we should design high speed infrastructure that is separated from the pedestrian/slow moving vehicle lanes to accommodate for trains and high speed buses and cars (what we consider regular buses and cars today).
anon, that is just about the most accurate description of the route 34 west plan that i've heard. its like someone just took the boston post road and plopped it between west river and the hill, its pretty incredible.

Posted by: Our Town | April 21, 2009 10:18 AM

ANON, once again you have delved into your bottomless stash of bogus statistics to support your bias. Those ASHTO numbers you sight were developed in the 1950's when traffic engineers determined people on highways (for safety reasons) should drive six car lengths apart at 60 MPH. The reality is that they drive about two car lengths apart, approximately the same density as at 25MPH. The second bogus part of your statistics about comparing 25 MPH local traffic to 55MPH highway traffic, is that the people on the 25 MPH road would be stopping at traffic lights every 400 feet.

Posted by: anon | April 21, 2009 10:36 AM

The figures are from the 2000s, not the 1950s, Our Town. Also, without having seen any of the plans seeing that they don't exist yet, how are you so sure that people (including ambulances and buses) on the 25 MPH road would be stopping at lights every 400 feet?

Posted by: The Count | April 21, 2009 11:38 AM

All I can say is, If Dick Lee werent't already dead...then this would have done it.

Posted by: norton street | April 21, 2009 12:30 PM

the count,
it is unclear from your post what your feelings on this issue actually are. While Mayor Lee's intentions and reasons for doing what he did were commendable, what actually happened to New Haven was horrendous, and its probably the best example in the world of why trying to make old colonial/industrial cities modern was the worst idea ever conceived and executed.

Posted by: cba | April 21, 2009 12:34 PM

Is this the same big baloney speaking mayor who championed the mall at Long Wharf with all of its supposed benefits ? That Mall is really an economic miracle

Posted by: The Count | April 21, 2009 3:27 PM

Norton St, re: my "Dick Lee" quote. In an interview just before he died, Lee claimed that one of the reasons he saw New Haven in decline was the lack of a completed Route 34 to bring valley denizens to New Haven. You and I both know that's a minor, if at all significant, factor. Lee went so far with "34" as to attempt to bull it through Wooster Square. The locals successfully fought off the attempt and the plans shifted it through the Oak St. area instead. It seems as though Mayor DeStefano is incrementally deconstructing the Lee legacy (not necessarily a bad thing). So, when I said the new plans for Route 34 would have been Lee's "coup de grace", I meant that, with all DeStefano has done, this would have been the "last straw" to make Lee give up the ghost, the highway being one of Lee's "crown jewels" in his redevelopment of the city. Ironically, it's called the Lee Connector. Verstehe?

Posted by: -- | April 21, 2009 4:14 PM

CBA- the mall area became IKEA and is now the number 7 tax payer in the city... so umm yeah.

Posted by: Streever | April 22, 2009 9:18 AM

I do think Anon is treading in dangerous waters of nonsense statistics--as usual?--but is right in the spirt of this. This is a great project & a win. Congrats to City Hall!

Posted by: ParkStTaxPayer | April 22, 2009 2:02 PM

fixed rail streetcars? YEAH!

move people, change behavior.

Less cars = less frustration at sitting in traffic = less traffic fatalities due to frustration of sitting in traffic and therefore blowing through red lights and killing pedestrians

Posted by: Milton Woodberry | April 22, 2009 7:59 PM

I lived on Porter St. back in the day, near Legion Ave. I remember the vacant lots between Legion & Parmalee Ave. I remember those lots were remnants of an old community that disappeared to make room for Rt. 34. I never understood the whole concept of 34 to begin with, let alone extending it all the way to the Boulevard. I now live in Sacramento, CA., & previously lived in Oakland, near San Francisco, where there's all sorts of traffic issues, beginning with the Bay Bridge. I hope that in the plans to eliminate the Rt. 34 corridor is a bypass lane of some sort to ease traffic into that area. I'm no civil engineer, but I think that's something to think about.

Posted by: Ned | April 24, 2009 11:12 AM

Can we just get rid of the Route 34 "Connector" already? Connect Union Station directly to downtown, so that when one emerges from Union Station there is a direct line of sight to downtown, rather than a path into "muggers paradise".