New Haven Independent

Posted by: Bill | May 26, 2009 3:53 PM

I have a job for you Mr. Kalb. Attend a partial birth abortion and then tell me it's not killing a baby.

Posted by: Sam | May 27, 2009 1:15 AM

Hey Bill, that comments has nothing to do with this article. You mean to imply that the author has made a contradictory conclusion on a separate issue that feels directly related to you.

Your logic is faulted in the simple fact that nowhere in this article does Kalb speak on partial-birth abortion.

Your comments would contribute much more if they were confined to the topic that was exported by Kalb. Perhaps you have a personal experience with the death penalty you would like to share.

A relative?

Posted by: Dudley Sharp | May 27, 2009 9:19 AM

Mr, Kalb:

All of your points were in error.

1.
Is the death penalty closure? Of course.

CLOSURE and EXECUTION
Dudley Sharp, contact info below

For those who have lost loved ones to murder, the execution of the murderer definitely brings closure.

The execution is closure to the legal process, whereby execution is the most just sanction available for the crime and the family is relieved that the murderer is dead and can no longer harm another innocent - a very big deal.

The confusion with "closure" is when some imply that execution can bring psychological or emotional closure to the devastation suffered by the murder victim's loved ones.

I know of no victim survivor who believes that execution could bring that type of closure. How could it? No punishment can, nor is that the intention.

The concept of emotional "closure" via execution is, often, a fantasy perpetrated by anti death penalty folks, just so they can denounce it, with a talking point, as in: "Those supporting capital punishment claim that closure is a major reason to support the death penalty - but there is no closure."

Do you know of any murder victim survivor who says that their emotional or psychological pain was closed once the murderer was executed? Me neither.

Murder victim "Mary Bounds' daughter, Jena Watson, who watched the execution, said Berry's action deprived the family of a mother, a grandmother and a friend, and that pain will never go away."

"We feel that we have received justice," she said Wednesday after the execution. "There's never an end to the hurt from a violent crime. There can never fully be closure. You have to learn to do the best you can. Tonight brings finality to a lot of emotional issues."

Ina Prechtl, who lost her daughter Felecia Prechtl. to a rape /murder said, after watching Karl Chamberlain executed: "One question I ask myself every day, why does it take so long for justice to be served?" It took 17 years for the execution. ("Texas executes 1st inmate since injection lull", 6/11/2008, MICHAEL GRACZYK, Associated Press Writer, HUNTSVILLE, Texas)

copyright 2009 Dudley Sharp, Permission for distribution of this document, in whole or in part, is approved with proper attribution.

Dudley Sharp, Justice Matters
e-mail sharpjfa@aol.com, 713-622-5491,
Houston, Texas

Mr. Sharp has appeared on ABC, BBC, CBS, CNN, C-SPAN, FOX, NBC, NPR, PBS , VOA and many other TV and radio networks, on such programs as Nightline, The News Hour with Jim Lehrer, The O'Reilly Factor, etc., has been quoted in newspapers throughout the world and is a published author.

A former opponent of capital punishment, he has written and granted interviews about, testified on and debated the subject of the death penalty, extensively and internationally.

Pro death penalty sites

essays http://homicidesurvivors.com/categories/Dudley%20Sharp%20-%20Justice%20Matters.aspx

http://www.dpinfo.com
http://www.cjlf.org/deathpenalty/DPinformation.htm http://www.clarkprosecutor.org/html/links/dplinks.htm
http://www.coastda.com/archives.html http://www.lexingtonprosecutor.com/death_penalty_debate.htm http://www.prodeathpenalty.com http://yesdeathpenalty.googlepages.com/home2 (Sweden)
http://www.wesleylowe.com/cp.html

Posted by: Dudley Sharp | May 27, 2009 9:34 AM

Mr. Kalb:

3. You need to complain to the Ct defense bar and the judiciary, regarding the horribly irresponsible death penalty system in Ct.

If you really care about the irresponsible death penalty protocol in Ct and what it does to victim survivors, improvement is always the option. However, I suspect your opposition to the death penalty makes you satisfied with the irresponsible and ridiculously expensive system in Ct.

For those others, who want the system to work, the solution is evident.

Reasonable and responsible protocols, currently in use, will produce a death penalty which costs no more, or will cost less, than Life Without Parole (LWOP).

Ct could better implement justice, as given by jurors, and save taxpayers money, currently wasted by many irresponsible state systems.

1) Obvious solution: Improve the system

Virginia executes in 5-7 years. 65% of those sentenced to death have been executed. Only 15% of their death penalty cases are overturned. The national averages are 11 years, 14% and 36%, respectively.

With the high costs of long term imprisonment, a true life sentence will be more expensive than such a death penalty protocol.

2) Current cost study problems

a) Geriatric care: Most cost studies exclude geriatric care, recently found to be $60,000-$90,000/inmate/yr., a significant omission from life sentence costs. Prisoners are often found to be geriatric at relatively young ages, 50-55, because of lifestyle.

b) Plea Bargain to life: ONLY the presence of the death penalty allows for a plea bargain to a maximum life sentence. Such plea cost benefit, estimated at $500,000 to $1 million/case, accrues as a cost benefit/credit to the death penalty. I am aware of no study which includes this.

c) The cost of death row: There need not be any additional cost for death row. Missouri and Kansas doesn't have one.

NOTE:

Depending upon jurisdiction, the inclusion of only 2a and 2b will result in a minimal cost differential between the two sanctions or an actual net cost benefit to the death penalty.

Adding (1) would, very likely, mean that all death penalty jurisdictions would see a cost savings with the death penalty as compared to a true life sentence.

Posted by: Dudley Sharp | May 27, 2009 10:29 AM

Mr. Kalb:

4. Of course there are many good reasons for the death penalty. Here are four of them.

The primary reason, of course, is justice, the foundation for all criminal sanctions and the reason juror pick the death penalty over a life sentence in some cases.

Secondarily but, nonetheless, very important is that the death penalty provides additonal protections for innocents.

Enhanced Due Process - No knowledgeable and honest party questions that the death penalty has the most extensive due process protections in US criminal law. Therefore, actual innocents are more likely to be sentenced to life imprisonment and more likely to die in prison serving under that sentence, that it is that an actual innocent will be executed. That is. logically, conclusive.

Enhanced Incapacitation - To state the blatantly clear, living murderers, in prison, after release or escape, are much more likely to harm and murder, again, than are executed murderers. Although an obvious truism, it is surprising how often folks overlook the enhanced incapacitation benefits of the death penalty over incarceration.

Enhanced Deterrence - 16 recent studies, inclusive of their defenses, find for death penalty deterrence. A surprise? No. Life is preferred over death. Death is feared more than life. Some believe that all studies with contrary findings negate those 16 studies. They don't. Studies which don't find for deterrence don't say no one is deterred, but that they couldn't measure those deterred. What prospect of a negative outcome doesn't deter some? There isn't one.

Posted by: Dudley Sharp | May 27, 2009 11:19 AM

Mr, Kalb:

All of your points were in error.

1. Is the death penalty closure? Of course

For those who have lost loved ones to murder, the execution of the murderer definitely brings closure.

The execution is closure to the legal process, whereby execution is the most just sanction available for the crime and the family is relieved that the murderer is dead and can no longer harm another innocent - a very big deal.

The confusion with "closure" is when some imply that execution can bring psychological or emotional closure to the devastation suffered by the murder victim's loved ones.

I know of no victim survivor who believes that execution could bring that type of closure. How could it? No punishment can, nor is that the intention.

The concept of emotional "closure" via execution is, often, a fantasy perpetrated by anti death penalty folks, just so they can denounce it, with a talking point, as in: "Those supporting capital punishment claim that closure is a major reason to support the death penalty - but there is no closure."

Do you know of any murder victim survivor who says that their emotional or psychological pain was closed once the murderer was executed? Me neither.

Murder victim "Mary Bounds' daughter, Jena Watson, who watched the execution, said Berry's action deprived the family of a mother, a grandmother and a friend, and that pain will never go away."

"We feel that we have received justice," she said Wednesday after the execution. "There's never an end to the hurt from a violent crime. There can never fully be closure. You have to learn to do the best you can. Tonight brings finality to a lot of emotional issues."

Ina Prechtl, who lost her daughter Felecia Prechtl. to a rape /murder said, after watching Karl Chamberlain executed: "One question I ask myself every day, why does it take so long for justice to be served?" It took 17 years for the execution. ("Texas executes 1st inmate since injection lull", 6/11/2008, MICHAEL GRACZYK, Associated Press Writer, HUNTSVILLE, Texas)

Posted by: Dudley Sharp | May 27, 2009 11:22 AM

Mr. Kalb:

2. You are in error. A life sentence is much more feared than execution. You should have noted that waiving death penalty appeals, as did Michael Ross, is extremely rare.

Some reality:

What percentage of capital murderers seek a plea bargain to a death sentence? Zero or close to it. They prefer long term imprisonment.

What percentage of convicted capital murderers argue for execution in the penalty phase of their capital trial? Zero or close to it. They prefer long term imprisonment.

What percentage of death row inmates waive their appeals and speed up the execution process? Nearly zero. They prefer long term imprisonment.

This is not, even remotely, in dispute.

What of that more rational group, the potential murderers who choose not to murder, is it likely that they, like most of us, fear death more than life?

Life is preferred over death. Death is feared more than life.

Posted by: Steven Kalb | May 27, 2009 12:23 PM

Mr. Sharp's comments are noteworthy although on their face I consider them foundation-less. I'd also argue for employing an editor if only to promote clarity and brevity.

Posted by: Dudley Sharp | May 27, 2009 12:31 PM

Mr. Kalb:

5. Your recommending that those who support execution view an execution sounds good.

How about you observe life without parole, OK?

More importantly, the context of the execution, or any sanction, should never be without a concentration on the murder victim, or other victims.

How about including the murder victims in your scenario.

You can visit the crime scene, then the morgue, the autopsy and the funeral.

Depending upon the age of the victim, you can then speak with the parents and contemplate, the graduations, the weddings, the grandchildren that will not be, all because innocent lives were taken by the selfishness of murderers.

You can talk with the parents of those small, now eternal moments, the hugs before leaving for school the kisses good night, which will, never be, again.

Posted by: Dudley Sharp | May 27, 2009 12:49 PM

Mr. Kalb:

The foundation of my points are quite clear, as were the factual errors in your column.

If you desire more foundation, let me know, I am happy to provide it.

Posted by: Walt | May 27, 2009 12:58 PM

A legitimate suggestion, Bill, especially if Kalb has supported abortion in past columns, as I believe, but am not certain, he has,

Comparison of the usual liberal wish for elimination of the death penalty for convicted murderers to the usual liberal position of death for innocent babies makes sense.

While a weak supporter of the death penalty ban, I wish strongly that the deaths of the innocent cbe banned.

Posted by: Walt | May 27, 2009 1:05 PM

Recidivism among executees is automatically low--a plus.

Posted by: Steven Kalb | May 27, 2009 4:29 PM

I am always thrilled the New Haven Independent provides readers an opportunity to provide feedback on stories and columns they have read. One always hopes their commentary is germane to the original work. Unfortunately sometimes it is not.

Posted by: William A Petit Jr MD | May 27, 2009 5:51 PM

Mr Kalb,
Nice to see your grinning face above your unsupported comments. I wonder if you would be grinning if you were there when two animals broke into my home and nearly beat me to death with a baseball bat. I wonder if you would be grinning if you watched them sexually molest my 11 year daughter. Perhaps the beating and torture of my 17 year old who had never hurt a soul in her life, or perhaps my wife with MS who did as they asked and then was strangled and burned and then these animals poured gas on my daughters while alive and lit them on fire and left the house allowing them to die tied to their own beds.
There will never be closure. The death penalty is about justice. It is about the fact that once you horribly and unjustifiably take a life you have forfeited your own. We have a system that allows for defense. Apparently they feel it is a game-my family had what, 30, 45, 60 seconds to consider their own deaths, yet 670 days later we are still waiting to go to trial because of the antics of the defense attorneys.
The death penalty serves its intended purpose-justice. revenge would be doing to these animals what they did to others without a trial.
The death penalty is a deterrent-the murderer can never kill again and there is adequate data to support that position. You are philosophically and morally wrong in your positions and statements. We need to stand up for what is right and not avoid things because they do not make us feel good. 70% of CT citizens support the death penalty-I am positive we can find an adequate number to too those convicted in the eye and administer justice.

Posted by: Tina Louise | May 27, 2009 11:45 PM

Steve,

Link to Governor Pataki article

http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/Articles/Pataki.htm

Posted by: Steven Kalb | May 28, 2009 8:44 AM

Dr. Petit,

Nothing I say or do can take away from the horror thrust upon your family two years. What was done to your family was unspeakable and should anger every person...everywhere and I cannot begin to understand or appreciate your pain and frustration with the criminal justice system.

That said, there are reams of evidence to indicate the death penalty provides no deterrence.

I wish you God-speed in your search for closure and justice.

Posted by: Tina Louise | May 28, 2009 8:53 AM

Steve,
You have a unique perspective on the "kill the killers" mentality? I don't think so. Perhaps you should have declined the invitation to watch the execution you were invited to attend.Your poignant version of looking into the eyes of someone who is about to receive his just sentence of death,by a jury of his peers,that has been legally mandated,is a slap in the face to victims everywhere.
Do you believe that your colorful portrayal of an execution impacts those who have had family members brutally,viciously murdered?
The answer is no.
You have sympathy for those who survive? Where,when or how do you implement your sympathy to these very real people,who could be your mother,your father,your child?

http://chasingnormal.blogspot.com/

Justice is the issue,not closure.
You were thrilled about the results of the vote here in Ct?
It is my experience,as the first rule of journalism, to check your facts. The Death Penalty most definitely is a deterrent to violent crime,and will continue to be.
http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/Articles/Pataki.htm

~The DEATH PENALTY IS about justice.It works.
Check your facts,so you may not write from a distance,with not a clue of the devastation involved.
Death up close and personal is the way the victims of families have to deal with it every day of their lives,forever,without those they love by their side anymore.

Posted by: Johanna Petit Chapman | May 28, 2009 10:31 AM

Mr Kalb,
I hope that my response offers you the brevity and clarity that you desire. I could not disagree with you anymore on most all of your. points.
You begin by telling us that Mr Ross is ivy educated, implying his intelligence. It doesn't matter because he was evil scum. Adding intelligent doesn't bolster his being. What about the intelligence of his victims?
Next you talk about closure. There is no such thing in abhorrent and heinous cases in which the DP is the only appropriate consequence. The "healing scab" that you speak of, yet I don't know if you have ever experienced, is always open and the salt is always flowing. The only closure is that of the criminals life. He loses his ability to read, think, smell and breathe. They have forfeited their right to live in civilized society.
Next you say that the DP is not a deterrent. Of course it is. Once the condemned is put to death, he is deterred from ever killing again. And, if we actually fixed the DP in CT, we would be executing people in a more timely fashion, making it yet more of a deterrent. The DP is not revenge. Revenge would be taking action on the criminal similar to that which he took on his victims. Without being too explicit, in our case, that would involve rape, beating, torture, gas... The DP is a consequence for an action. Based on your comments, it does not sound as though you think that jail is a deterrent either.
You talk about looking into the eyes of the condemned as he is executed. Once again, it is about the criminal. What about the victims eyes? They can never look into the eyes of their loved ones again. Or is it about you and the horror that haunts you? May you never experience real evil which causes horror which haunts daily. Your accounting reminds me of the Senator who said that her birthday will never be the same again because it falls on the same day as the day Mr Ross was executed. No care for the victims. Only the criminals and yourselves.
Finally, there is one point which we agree on. The DP should not be taken lightly. There needs to be due process...just not frivolous, endless appeals.

Posted by: Steven Kalb | May 28, 2009 11:34 AM

With all due respect Dr. Petit we will have to agree to disagree on most of the points in your latest note.

Here is what I do know: having spoken with family members of those who were victims (not all as there are no absolutes) I have been told by them and heard them tell others (at press conferences for example) that there was no "closure" for them after Michael Ross (or other convicted murderers) have been executed.

I also know (from speaking with and listening to the families of victims) that the countless hearings, appeals, appeals of appeals, etc.. have opened and re-opened the same wounds causing the survivor's families incredible pain and suffering.

I believe (vs. what-I-know) that a life-in-prison with the possibility of parole law is significantly better alternative. Michael Ross happily chose to end his appeals and sought be executed because he came to realize that life in prison is hell-on-earth.

As I indicted earlier, there is no way possible for me or anyone else to understand the anger and pain you must feel.

You spoke at one point of morality. I believe that the state does not have the moral or ethical right to take a life.

As I indicated earlier, I wish you God-speed in finding closure (to the extent that is possible) and the justice you seek.

Posted by: William A Petit Jr | May 28, 2009 11:58 AM

You entirely miss the point-the Death Penalty never was and is not about deterrent-it is about justice in a civilized society.
Do you recognize your own imbedded prejudices-does it matter that Ross was IVY educated as he tortured, raped, and murdered multiple innocent women? No it does not-we are equal under the law. His entire last years were about publicity for himself as a way to make him feel better.
For the second time this is not about closure, but justice.
Why would you bring up the bizarre argument that somehow victim's families would feel better after an execution-tell me how you would feel if someone beat, tortured, raped and murdered your family members-the death of the perpetrator would do nothing to bring back your loved ones that is quite obvious and why it is an inappropriate and incorrect argument.
You should have significantly less understanding and respect for the legislators who get in the way of justice and do all in their power to prevent justice from being served.
as I stated we have many just and brave people here in CT who would be willing to do just what you will not.

Posted by: Common Sense | May 28, 2009 5:35 PM

Steve, like many in the State Legislature "You Don't Get It". Justice is just what it is "Justice".

Posted by: Name Withheld | May 28, 2009 6:16 PM

What would Jesus do?

No joke. Really. Would he call the killers "animals" and want them put to death? Or would he pray for their lost souls and hope for human redemption?

Personally I don't want the State killing anyone in my name. It doesn't make anything right or better. Not at all. Killing is wrong is by far the best message.

So while I acknowledge Dr. Petit's legitimate rage, his passion for killing those two criminals should be tempered by greater understanding.

Posted by: Mike | May 28, 2009 6:17 PM

The debate can go on and on, but the reality is that the death penalty is a legal fiction in Connecticut. Nobody will ever be executed in this state unless they want to be executed. The death penalty will be repealed in the coming years, when a democrat is elected to the office of Governor. It is that simple.

In the meantime, Connecticut taxpayers will continue to pay prosecutors and defense attorneys (these guys are not hiring private counsel after all) to prosecute and then defend endless appeals and habeas corpus petitions. It makes good work for lawyers.

Posted by: THREEFIFTHS | May 28, 2009 9:24 PM

Hey Bill:
Check this website out www.dbcuuc.org/sermons/1001001.htm why abortion is not murder.Also for all of you Christian who are for the Death Penalty,How come when Cain killed Abel,God did not use the Death Penalty,God put a mark on his forehead and stated Cain was not to be Harmed.

Posted by: L | May 28, 2009 11:28 PM

I think it is utterly disgusting (and a whole bunch of other negatives) that people would continue to argue on this thread with Dr. Petit and his family. Shame on you. You have no idea what he went through. I have no idea, but what happened to him and his family has affected so many of us so deeply. I am a Democrat and a liberal, but will not blindly follow the liberal line and oppose the death penalty. There is right and there is wrong. There needs to be justice.

Posted by: Blarney | May 28, 2009 11:42 PM

I see that many people have stayed away from this debate...East Rock bikes, littering, hell even the mayor...that is all ok. No one wants to weigh in on this...because lives have been lost. But I find it odd that because a doctor from Cheshire is a victim, then it is news. And no one want to step on his toes. Although no one wants to minimize the pain and suffering of this family, if the same were to happen to a family in Fair Haven...well...it wouldn't be such news and it wouldn't be on the pages of CT news corps. Equal treatment by the law or in life is unrealistic. There are many people murdered in a hideous way in CT, but they don't get the spot light because they are not from important families...or of a family with means to reach out to the media. There are regular families out there that have lost loved ones to murder, yet everyone is knee jerking to this one. No one wants to minimize this suffering, the horrible acts visited upon this family is heart breaking...so how about we make it equal for everyone...not just those with means to do so?

Posted by: Tom Burns | May 29, 2009 1:21 AM

Mr. Petit,
I have never felt the pain I have felt for you and your family. I have no idea how you go on from day to day. What those animals did to your family is beyond belief and our world needs to be rid of them. I am a christian who believes in Jesus Christ and I can guarantee you that he wants to see them as soon as possible. They need not to be here anymore and if I could personally make it happen, I would---in the name of Christ---I hope that our legal system takes them away---for their sake as well as yours and mine---I wish on that day you were able to take the bat from them and destroyed their pitiful lives----good God I pray for you and your family every day--If you need anything I am here for you as are soooo many others---I'm sorry for your loss which is beyond belief----Tom Burns 860-227-6668

Posted by: Bill | May 29, 2009 7:43 AM

Hey THREEFIFTHS,
You link is bad. In any case Pope John Paul II taught that to be pro-like was to be against both the death penalty and abortion. How can any Christian be so concerned for the life of a murderer and not a helpless unborn baby. The survival of younger and younger premature babies has demonstrated what should be obvious, these are babies being killed by the millions. If you are not against abortion you are NOT a Christian.

Posted by: Streever | May 29, 2009 9:29 AM

Blarney:

Many of us post comments because we are in a position to change something, and have an educated/reasoned opinion on the matter. I suspect few of us who deal with neighborhood crime, biking, traffic issues, zoning, & the like have the knowledge or background or ability to affect change on this topic, and for that reason, have declined to comment.

I actually find the inverse odd: that people would comment on this/challenge others who have experienced it/and yet ignore real issues that affect their life on a day to day basis.

Posted by: Walt | May 29, 2009 9:47 AM

Is Kalb a paid columnist for the Independent or just a fellow liberal reporter, laid off and seeking a new slot?

He used to get similar star treatment, with photo, from the Hamden Daily News , a computer news operation formerly run by a relation of our esteemed Independent Editor, I think.

Just curious,

Posted by: William Kurtz | May 29, 2009 12:52 PM

Blarney,

Speaking for myself, I started a couple of times to respond to this article but found it difficult to craft a response without feeling that I would come across as sounding somehow critical of Dr. Petit. Like a previous poster, I acknowledge the legitimacy of his rage. I won't suggest that he temper himself with greater understanding; the imagination can barely begin to comprehend the extent of his loss, his grief and his anger, but the intensity of his passion illustrates why the the death penalty should be anathema to any civilized society.

The death penalty is one of those instances where it's dangerous to argue from the specific to the general. If ever there were people for whom the death penalty was a suitable punishment, they are Stephen Hayes and Joshua Komisarjevky. Make no mistake: my objection to capital punishment has nothing to do with sympathy for monstrous criminals, Christian injunctions to 'turn the other cheek and forgive' or a desire to see the worst of the worst coddled and treated with dignity; I would be as satisfied as the next citizen to see them punished in as unpleasant and painful a way as man can devise.

But that's not justice; it's revenge, or something close enough to it anyway. It's far more primal and far less civilized than justice. I deny neither its existence nor its power, but I firmly believe that a modern civilized society must reject its influence.

The death penalty can never be about justice. Humans and human institutions are not infallible. A story in CTNewsJunkie mentioned that the 116th person to be exonerated from death row testified before the state legislature while they debated this bill. Does anyone truly believe that those 116 individuals, whose convictions were vacated by evidence that we have only had the capacity to evaluate for about the past 15-20 years or so are the only ones unjustly convicted? Does anyone truly believe that an innocent person has never been executed? Show me one other human endeavor with a success rate of 100%.

Not every criminal is caught fleeing the scene in a car stolen from their victims. What about cases not so clear cut? How much of a margin for error do we allow? How do we decide which crimes are heinous enough to call for death? We do a poor job of balancing aggravating and mitigating factors now. I don't see that process getting any more efficient.

Perhaps there is a small measure of justice in capital punishment. I agree with Dr. Petit on this point: there are acts a person can commit that forfeit their right to life, but as a society, we haven't yet demonstrated that we have the capacity to determine those situations accurately, fairly, and dispassionately. To condemn an innocent person to death, as we almost certainly have done and almost certainly will do again, is to sentence another family to the same pain that arouses these impassioned calls for justice by the loved ones of crime victims.

Posted by: Michael Rocci | May 29, 2009 1:30 PM

Mr. Klab,

You should do some educated research before you put your foot in you mouth and your thoughts on paper. Take for instance China. Read the following article and ponder why they are so effective in halting violent crimes. I'm positive it's not because they pamper their devil-like murderers!

The Shanghai daily recently ran an article, entitled, "Homicide rates down as cracking rate up." According to the article, China had 31,000 homicides, of which more than 20,000 were murders. This is down from 33,000 and nearly 25,000 in 2004. The police "cracked" 89.6 percent of the homicide cases, compared to 63 percent in the United States.

China's Ministry of Public Security recently launched a campaign that "requires all local public security authorities to crack at least 85 percent of their homicide cases, and to ensure the number of homicide cases and escapee criminals will decline by 2007." I find it difficult to believe this campaign will do anything more than cause local authorities to play with the statistics, to the extent they are not doing so already, but I will bet that the numbers in next year's Shanghai Daily article will be even more impressive.

China had 554,000 cases of seriously violent crimes (never defined) last year, down 2.16 percent from 2004.

By way of comparison, there are typically around 16,000 murders in the United States and around 1.3 million violent crimes per year, out of a population of approximately 300 million. Therefore, if China's murder statistics are accurate, one is around four times more likely to be murdered in the United States than in China. If (and this is a big if) violent crime means the same thing in the two countries and if (and this too is a big if) China's statistics are as accurate as the United States, one is around sixteen times more likely to be the victim of a violent crime in the United States as in China.

Posted by: Mark | May 29, 2009 2:02 PM

Mr. Kalb:
There is an element missing from our justice system and that missing element is justice. Victims and their families are all but forgotten by our so-called system of justice. The opportunities for endless, baseless appeals by those charged with a crime represent a tremendous waste of money and to favor the accused casting the victims aside as a result. I support the death penalty not as a deterrent or for revenge, but as appropriate justice for those who make a choice to take another's life. In doing so, they forfeit their right to life. The fact that you watched (your decision by the way) poor Michael Ross take his last breath and characterize how horrible it must have been for him - cry me a river! What about Ross' victims and the horror they went through. In the Petit case, the monsters sought and identified their victims and then spent the rest of their Sunday afternoon and evening planning what they were going to do. Neither one of them at any point thought during those hours that what they planned to do wasn't right. A day doesn't go by that I don't think about the Petit women, the terrible end to their lives and what the world now must forgo because we don't have the benefit of their good work and kindness any longer. The monsters made a choice and with choices come consequences. That's what justice is about and in some cases, the just thing to do is a sentence of death.

Posted by: William Kurtz | May 29, 2009 4:25 PM

Mr. Rocci,

Where is that article? There wasn't a link in your post; is it available online?

I agree that violent crime in the United States is an extensive and complex problem, but in your own analysis, the Chinese statistics are suspect, the definitions they use (how do they distinguish the 20,000 murders from the 31,000 homicides, for example) and it seems plausible that government edicts about clearing a certain percentage of cases lead to sloppy police work--if not outright fraud. I am curious as to what you are trying to prove.

Posted by: Tom | May 29, 2009 11:26 PM

China? Really? Do we really want to compare ourselves to an authoritarian society?

This is such a hard issue and I see faulty logic on both sides. And I see good points as well. I am deeply skeptical that the death penalty prevents crime (the Pataki article is specious b/c no one has been put to death in New York during that time and various DAs refuse to call for it regardless. Moreover, violent crime was down NATIONWIDE during his tenure).

On the other hand, I see the point about it being about justice...I think. Yet, what is justice? Many courthouses depict libra, the balancing scales. The suggestion being that equanimity, balance and harmony can be achieved. But can it? An eye for an eye doesn't always work. Joseph Mengele was responsible for the deaths of nearly 400,000 at Auschwitz. Had he been put to death, would there have been balance? That seems insulting to the victims to say the least. Because of this, and other factors, I share Mr. Kalb's concerns about closure. Yet, I don't feel comfortable judging whether closure has been or will be reached for individuals. A large part of my conscience wants to give the victim's families EXACTLY what they want, but I know this is not and should not be the basis of law.

Perhaps justice is about taking away a right that has been abused. Life is right that the murderers of the Petit women certainly abused and I do see that abuse as a forfeiture.

I also share the notion that Christ would not seek the Death Penalty. I can think of no case when given the choice between condemnation and mercy, that he did not chose mercy, not one. YET, the dirty secret is that Christ's teachings were not about governance of a society whereas the laws of Moses that he challenged WERE about governing a society...and we live in a society that must be governed. I could delve more deeply into this but I don't want to get lost in theology.

I wish I had a comprehensive and conclusive answer to this, but I do not. But we might want to take a breath and stop demonizing each other, or at least stop demonizing the people of good will on both sides. Instead, we would all do well to focus on those things that keep predators off the street (the DP is, at best, merely a partial solution..if that). I'm sure we all would rather have prevented the crime in Cheshire and others like it than punishing the guilty after the fact. In my view, the Petit tragedy has more to do with sentencing and parole and administrative negligence therin.

Posted by: laurel Okeefe | May 29, 2009 11:29 PM

Mr Kalb,
Even the title of this piece is disrespectful and innapropraite-'Execute this?!' Is this the best that a profesional journalist could come up with for such a serious and impassioned issue as the the death penalty? As soon as I saw the title I figured it as yet another liberal writer who fancies himself a courageous humanitarien via his avid anti-death penalty stance...but admittedly this time there is an extra twist; You are more of a self described expert on the subject because you personally attended the execution by lethal injection, of a serial rapist and murderer of women and little girls. First of all For you to really have made an objective and fair interpretation re the execution of Mr Ross,and executions in general, you really should have borne witness to at least one of the man's many rapes and murders, for only THEN could you ever imagine the depths of that mans evil and the incredible fear pain and suffering that he caused so many. And yes Mr Kalb, there are people that are in fact pure evil in this world, despite what your intellectualizing offers. Here is a suggestion; Next time you take on such an immensely powerful issue, first show some real respect for the victims of crimes and thier families you should consider them with every word you write. Secondly, do your homework, 'the death peanlty never deterred any murderer?' Please cite your sources for this utterly incorrect supposition, for as several commenters have shown via links to multiple studies, the exact opposite has been proven. Thirdly, be honest with yourself and your readers, dont throw out an obligatory I feel for the victims I really do and I hope they find closure" Your weak attempt at appearing appropriately compassionate towards the actual victims of violent crime, is insulting and lacks credibility; As one of your readers pointed out, youve said and done nothing to show this empathy, In fact, you elaborate ad nauseum about the evils of the death penalty and all of those who support it,including the governor, who you suggest should be forced to attend executions and be made to "look in the eyes of the killer being injected with fatal drugs, Yet you give no such vehement condemnation of the murderers or the savage acts that led them to be in the position to recieve the death penalty. In fact you dont even mention it really. I find your over the top anger towards legislators and citizens alike that support the death penalty, completely out of whack with any normal human concern for the victims that lay in these killers wakes.

Posted by: Blarney | May 30, 2009 12:12 AM

Will,
Your response is not only tactful but based in reality and well written. Finally some discourse with substance. Oh sorry, how Derrida of me.

Posted by: Consti2amend | May 30, 2009 4:58 AM

I am a FIRM believer in the death penalty. I have had a loved-one murdered in their own store. They were NOT even given a chance to "surrender". When I was told they {the perps} could get the death penalty, I did NOT hesitate to let them know my feelings.

"If you have trouble finding someone to throw the switch, call me. I've been practicing throwing switches since I was three years old!"

To Gov. Rell, if you need my assistance, feel free to look me up.

By the way, yes, some innocent people have been sentenced to the death penalty. Some may have even had their sentence carried out. BUT, I'll guess there are far more deserving the death penalty who don't get it, than those that did.

Posted by: Julie Bilotta | May 30, 2009 10:37 AM

I have read all of the commentary and was incredibly moved and saddened by Mr. William A Petit Jr. MD's response.

I am so deeply sorry Mr. Petit for that incredible Evil, unjustly bestowed upon you.

A bevy of philosophical questions come to mind, but this I know for sure:

Sociopaths don't learn the err of their ways in prison, they just adapt.

Despite what the wardens turn the other cheek to, prison-life becomes a way of life.

Relishing in the thought that 'life' behind bars could equate to some form of justice doesn't fly with me.

Actions of such great ill-intent can never be justified in the courtroom, lest the mercy of the Lord.

Describing Michael Ross as an "Ivy-league educated serial rapist and murderer" was right on point. That is in fact, who he was.

Understandably there are vacant and fulfilled minds both emotionally and spiritually. With or without the caveat of an education, esp. one with vines will never cease to disturb me.

Despite Ross' wish to be executed after 20 years of not enjoying the quality of his life is not of my concern.

How can one have even the slightest fiber of compassion for someone who has none?

We are not talking petty crimes here... not a Modus Operandi to gain a few bucks. We're talking misfired minds that see torturous beating, raping, brutality and sheer pain as their pleasure and power.

The game? To 'win'.

There are no gains to a long stand 'in the yard'. The prison sex, gangs, 'emotional hardship' of isolation is a nominal slap on the wrist compared to lovely souls graced with normal DNA.

I remember Steve how you wrestled with the execution. Being a part of something that dishonours your personal beliefs is brave for a journalist.

If I were not your friend, I would express myself exactly the same, but the fact that I am, makes me confident to say that I believe in the Death Penalty 100%.

With the 'What would Jesus do?' referenced as part of the commentary, I beg to question:

"If Jesus can die for our sins, why can't a murderer or rapist die for their own?"

I am sure that a murderous perspective has nothing to do with God or personal accountability.

I am holding back like a Thoroughbred behind the Breeder's Cup gates here on this Christian theologian perspective, yet that would just mitigate my point.

I conclude by wishing anyone who has had the misfortune of such barbaric acts Peace, and those whose personal posture does not align with the killing of a human soul, a nod of respectful opposition.

You've got people talking Steve.

Your radio-friendly buddy,
Jules

*This photo is not me, but might at well be*

Posted by: jack | May 30, 2009 10:48 PM

the death penalty is just and needed

Posted by: THREEFIFTHS | June 1, 2009 5:53 AM

Hey bill
Should the Killers of the abortion doctor that was murder in church be put to death,And what would the Pope John Paul II say?

Posted by: Robert Vogel | June 1, 2009 11:09 AM

When I was about 10, I watched a young neighbor use a string to hang his cat from a porch railing. Probably almost everyone would agree that this is pathological. It could be that the executioner, when an adult, changed his ways, but if he didn't he ought not to be in government.

So here's the question: Why is it that Republicans along with their 'pro-life', talk-radio propagandists favor not just waterboarding but the death penalty ?

George W. Bush during his six years as governor of Texas presided over 152 executions, more than any other governor in the recent history of the United States. Still Republicans nominated him and we are all paying the price. Republicans at the very top spawned Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib, waterboarding, secret prisons, and other lawless 'justice'. The US now has the highest rate of incarcerations in the world.

Both the Ct House and Senate passed a bill to abolish the death penalty. The death penalty does not save money. It is no deterrent. It is error prone. It is vengeful, but satisfies no one. Because of US continued use of the death penalty, advanced countries refuse to extradite to us. The Declaration of Independence reads "a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation." But Republicans don't respect international law.

Governor Rell, a true Republican, has said she intends to veto It.
To be silent is to be an accessory to these crimes. We should oppose Republicans in government and on talk radio. They are a threat to democracy, the economy, the Constitution, civilization, and the habitability of the planet.

Posted by: Tom | June 1, 2009 11:16 AM

Laurel, I agree that the tone of the title "execute this" is inappropriate, flippant and not in keeping with the gravitas of the issue. Mr. Kalb, lose the self-righteous swagger.

But, :aurel, I'm afraid this oft repeated converse conclusion is off target. If not P, then Q. That is, those who oppose the dp must care more for the perpetrators than the victims, as if to say that in order to care for the victims, support for the DP is the ONLY possible choice.

Do people who oppose abortion care less for the mother? Do people who oppose the war support Sadaam Hussein? Hardly. Moreover, one can make an equally compelling case that SOME who support the DP are focusing more on the criminal than the victims, too. Their (justifiable) anger at the accused becomes singular and total. In some cases many of them tend to melt away after the execution has been carried out.

While it is true that there are those who care more about the condemned than the victims, that is an insane position on the face of it (I think we agree on that). Moreover,from a political stand point, there is no constituency for it and therefore it would be political suicide. I don't see a coherent motive for that position.

My point is simply that to represent all or most opponents of the DP as being somehow more sympathetic to the criminals than the victims is demonization, unhealthy, and counterproductive.

Posted by: laurel Okeefe | June 1, 2009 12:45 PM

Tom,

I do believe that it was quite clear within my comment that I was addressing Mr Kalb and HIS sentiments contained in HIS article. Nowhere in my comment did I make sweeping generalizations that all death penalty abolishionists have no care for victims of crime. Indeed, I suggested that Mr Kalb show at least equal consideration for the victims of the the criminals that he was empathizing with, AGAIN, within this article, starting with Mr Ross, whose execution was used at the nucleus of his argument.

Posted by: Tom | June 1, 2009 3:17 PM

ok, my misunderstanding. I apologize

Posted by: Westville Mom | June 1, 2009 8:07 PM

Hey ROBERT VOGEL:

When I clicked on your name, I got a big red message reading "ATTACK SITE!" and notifying me that my computer was blocking sites that "... use your computer to attack others ..." and "...intentionally distribute harmful software..."

Isn't it AMAZING what a perceptive and shrewd judge of character computers have become these days ???

(btw, when it comes to anthropomorphic machines, I would put my computer up against Obama's teleprompter ANY day!)

Oh, and I was going to rebut your comment by saying that liberals typically do care more about cruelty to animals than cruelty to human babies and innocents, ... but then I thought that might be stooping to your level, so I reconsidered. (After all, we Republicans love cats, too.)

Posted by: Robert Vogel | June 1, 2009 9:52 PM

My Apology. I only today found that my website has been infected.

Someone put malware (a piece of binary javascript into several pages), and google informed me of the problem. I think it is clean now.

The post above would have had links to the better part of the discussion. Google most likely has not yet cleared the warning, but if you adventurous see http://www.seconnecticut.com/death_penalty.htm

Posted by: Tina Louise | June 6, 2009 1:47 AM

Mr Kalb,
You appear to have abandoned and/or not addressed
extremely pertinent and well thought out responses
to your "Execute This" piece,including the title.
Laurel Okeefe expressed it quite well
"you elaborate ad nauseum about the evils of the death penalty and all of those who support it,including the governor, who you suggest should be forced to attend executions and be made to "look in the eyes of the killer being injected with fatal drugs, Yet you give no such vehement condemnation of the murderers or the savage acts that led them to be in the position to recieve the death penalty"
**Our Governor has vetoed the bill today,6/5/2009**

http://www.ct.gov/governorrell/cwp/view.asp?A=3675&Q=441204

May I suggest a piece on Victims Rights?It might include concrete suggestions as to how our legal system might provide speedier trials for those who decide that they have the right to murder another human beings.