New Haven Independent

Posted by: robn | May 21, 2009 1:13 PM

...or how about standing up for the peaceful principles that MLK espoused and prosecute the pack of teens who beat up an African American driver in Newhallville last summer?

Maybe its just easier to rename streets and propose monuments?

P.S. Last time I checked, Whalley Ave didn't run through Alderman Shah's ward.

Posted by: noname | May 21, 2009 1:21 PM

this is ridiculous - why not wait until a new road is built (yes, we have introduced new roadways in the city in recent years). Whalley Ave, will always be Whalley Ave. I do not think it is completely respectable to Dr. King to tag his name onto Whalley Ave. I also think it is somewhat disrespectful to the history that named Whalley Ave in the first place. We can't pick and choose when we are going to be respectful to those who came before us. That roadway has already been named, move in a forward motion and address the issue with the City Plan department and request a future roadway be named after Dr. King.
This is an election year for the Alder's. Is this just a ploy for votes?

Posted by: john | May 21, 2009 1:28 PM

The Rev. Dr. King was a great man in his preaching of civility and nonviolence, e.g.:

"The aftermath of nonviolence is the creation of the beloved community." (Sermon, "Birth of a New Nation" del. 4/7/57)

Here's question: is the anticipated aftermath of renaming Whalley after Dr. King a less violent, more civil epicenter of a community that truly respects not only its own, but (as Shah states), "all humanity"?

If renaming the avenue is an actual call to renew the civility in all mankind toward all mankind, then I say go for it. If, however, it's just a political opportunity to paper over problems, tensions, and divisions that are willingly sustained by any one party out of its own self-interests, then I say 'why bother?'

I believe in change and so voted 'Obama.' But is the "change" proposed above really one I "can believe in"? It depends, I think, on whether the community itself also believes in the true implications of that change.

Posted by: Alphonse Credenza | May 21, 2009 1:39 PM

Neither street should be renamed. Edward Whalley's name is of great importance to the history of New Haven, as is Dixwell's, for nearly 400 years.

Where is the New Haven's Historic Preservation Officer? This is a New Haven structure that needs to be preserved.

Posted by: norton street | May 21, 2009 2:46 PM

eh, this doesnt seem to make too much sense. rename north frontage road mlk blvd, that street has no historic, cultural or civic significance to anything. the goal of cecil group's development of route 34 should rely heavily on the creation of a neighborhood thoroughfare that allows for dense small localized businesses. and if renaming a street does in fact "give more meaning" to the area then it will be perfect for route 34. it will give people something to care about instead of a horrid reminder of 60 years of mistakes.

Posted by: Been Called Worse | May 21, 2009 4:00 PM

Window dressing. Posturing. Thats all this amounts to. An *easy* victory for the alderman that does absolutely nothing to make a tangible difference in a person's day to day life.

I have no problem with a street renaming other than it takes away Shah's focus and energy from far more meaningful intiatives. Sorry if this sounds overly negative, but I think we need to "be real about what's happening in our community", and I don't think this is a measurable step to address meaningful issues.

Posted by: nfjanette | May 21, 2009 4:17 PM

Urban renewal decimated many of Dixwell's small businesses in the 1960s. Dixwell Plaza, the one main shopping center, has struggled to keep going at times, although some businesses there, as well as the Stetson Library, are busy.

How do you figure urban renewal had anything to do with the decline of that area? The loss of middle-class income once provided by factory jobs would seem to be the major player in that part of town.

Posted by: DingDong | May 21, 2009 4:33 PM

Norton Street, I think you're on a roll. I agree with 100% with all your comments in the last few days. Thanks for saying what I want to say better than me.

Posted by: Our Town | May 21, 2009 4:41 PM

I'm glad I read all the comments before posting, because this is the first time I've ever agreed with anything Norton Street has said. North Frontage Road will never be the frontage road it was designed to be and runs through Shah's ward. The current name is a placeholder, and this is a perfect street to honor MLK. The street is destined for big plans, and is the hope of the locals to unite neighborhoods. Although I prefer it as the pastoral park it is (get the parking lots out and it's a river of green through the city), if it will become a business/residential area, the MLK name is grand.

Posted by: norton street | May 21, 2009 5:23 PM

they like me, they really like me!

nfjanette,
urban renewal (in new haven especially, but it applies to every old american city) was a (too late) last ditch effort to rejuvenate 'the city' by rescaling it to accommodate the automobile (which, unknowingly destroyed the human/pedestrian scale). rescaling for the automobile entailed demolishing vast numbers of small local retail spaces (which often had apartments above) and replaced it with surface parking lots. large chain stores could operate in big box buildings and utilize the new parking lots. roads were widened which took away sidewalk room for people and in some cases street trees as well. historic neighborhoods were replaced with monotonous, large, brick structures that some how passed for housing.this way of approaching city planning has ensured that dixwell will be the only true ghetto in new haven until it is rescaled properly. dixwell is the neighborhood in new haven that is most affected by urban renewal, very little of its traditional housing remains, from the eldery housing on henry/county/munson, to the entire area from goffe, to canal, south of admiral, and north of bristol, dixwell is the slum of all slums in new haven. monterey housing is far from excellent, but i am not going to advocate for its demolition. lost of industrial jobs was also a major factor but it is almost one in the same with urban renewal, they are not completely exclusive to each other.
you are partly correct, but dont underestimate the devasting effects to streets, communities, neighborhoods, cities, and the country that came from urban renewal.

Posted by: Alderman Shah | May 21, 2009 6:02 PM

I can't say enough how I respect the opinions of the people on this comment page.
My opinion is that we need to have a street named after MLK.
I urge you all to wait until you read the proposal before you pass judgment on my thoughts and idea.

As soon as I have it all done, I think that you will see why this should be done in New Haven CT.

No disrespect to 400 years of history, however as our community evolves we must stay open and receptive to new Ideas and new thinking.

I understand that most people believe that everything Aldermen do or say is political. This issue is not.

This is just my opinion as a fellow citizen of the City of New haven. I will enjoy reading your comments especially after the proposal becomes available for public inspection.

Posted by: Consti2amend | May 21, 2009 6:02 PM

I firmly believe we should leave Whalley Ave. alone! If it wasn't for people like Whalley, Goffe, etc, then there would NOT have been an MLK!
After all, our founding father's ENABLED us to have freedom of speech. Thus enabling MLK to go on to be the great man that he was!

Posted by: bunker | May 21, 2009 6:03 PM

Have they reached the required number of shootings on Whalley Ave. to qualify it to be renamed MLK Blvd.??

Posted by: anon | May 21, 2009 6:52 PM

Whalley Ave should not be renamed. That is a very strange proposition, given New Haven's history, and I doubt that MLK would be supportive of the idea. Renaming North Frontage, or South Frontage, would be a better choice, as Norton Street points out. Those streets will be rebuilt and thriving someday, like Whalley Avenue.

Posted by: DingDong | May 21, 2009 8:03 PM

Alderman Shah,

We'll wait until we see the proposal, or at least I will, but I think it would be a shame to rename Whalley as there is so much history behind the name (and its intersection with Goffe and Dixwell - the namesakes of the other regicides). I think renaming Frontage Road sounds like a much better idea, or maybe even Edgewood Ave.

Posted by: DingDong | May 21, 2009 8:13 PM

And Alderman Shah,

I'm sure you won't listen to the know-nothings who comment here who think Whalley was a more important or impressive historical figure than Dr. MLK (he wasn't). As a (white) American, there is hardly anyone whom I find more inspiring or who makes me more proud to be American than Dr. MLK.

But Whalley is so distinctively New Haven; almost every city has a MLK Boulevard. That's part of the reason I am hesitant about your (not-yet-public) proposal.

Is there a local civil rights leader we might honor instead? Or Cinque Singbie Pieh Boulevard? (I also still like Norton Street's idea about MLK and Frontage Road).

Posted by: TrueBlueCT | May 21, 2009 10:06 PM

A more common sense idea would be to rename North Frontage Road as such.

Or maybe even better, re-name it Obama Avenue, which would be a lot more fun.

Posted by: robn | May 21, 2009 10:22 PM

WOW

Alderman Shah is so incorrigibly and warmly complimentary...I can see why he's consistently re-elected.

Posted by: Beaver Hill Resident | May 21, 2009 10:28 PM

As Norton St. says,"rename north frontage road mlk blvd." Whalley Avenue should remain Whalley Avenue.

Posted by: jack | May 21, 2009 10:32 PM

rename a New Haven war zone after Dr. King? talk about Orwellian b.s. give me a brake

Posted by: Whatsername | May 21, 2009 11:11 PM

Yeah, I'm with Norton Street on this one. I had to find out what a "frontage road" was when Our Town mentioned it (which is "A local road or street auxiliary to, and located on the side of, a highway or other limited access road. A frontage road is usually for service to abutting property and adjacent areas, and for control of access to the highway") and have to agree with him. I'm sure Alderman Shah has his reasons, but it would be nice for him to actually change his mind in this case. Not hating on Shah, but I feel Norton Street's idea is inspired.

Posted by: frank b | May 22, 2009 12:41 AM

To name a street so synonoumous with crime after a man who we all agree acomplished great things is an insult to his legacy and our intelligence. The idea of naming things after people just to put their name out there makes no sense.
Obama's historic election has hopefully helped us put the last 400 hundred years in out rear view mirror as we look forward in this time of change to what good the NEXT 400 years have to offer us.
Let us remember the Man for what he acomplished and stood for rather than the crimes that may take place on the thoroughfare that bares his name.
I cannot help but notice that of all the aldermen in new haven, it is you that puts the most emphasis on race. Please sir, try to put the emphasis on the individual first, the quality of the human being and ideal of a community without assignments of race, gender, preferences, or income.

Posted by: wow | May 22, 2009 6:06 AM

If the thought is violence will slow down, and or stop, wake up people. If it is to respect a great man, that can be done by following in his foot steps. Starting within the HOME. The answer is always in front of us, but yet we are still blind.

Posted by: JZ | May 22, 2009 9:52 AM

Changing street names = spending money. The city doesn't have any money. It's irresponsible to suggest a project like this should go foward regardless.

Posted by: anon | May 22, 2009 9:59 AM

If you feel strongly that renaming Whalley Avenue is a bad idea (and renaming Frontage a much better one), you might want to give Alderman Shah a phone call. I'm sure he is more likely to listen to actual residents than anonymous commenters, and he is a very reasonable person to talk with.

You also might want to call the Mayor's office or other Aldermen and explain your thoughts, since this is something that would affect the entire city, not just a small area along the avenue.

Posted by: Seth | May 22, 2009 3:18 PM

Whether there is a street named after MLK or not, we will still have the problems that are exacerbated by the residents of the city who disrespect the work of this great man with their everyday actions.

We currently have a school named after MLK with a police firing range across the street which operates DURING school hours. I'd like to see more Alderman bring their attention to this atrocity.

The people of this city are so used to being systematically victimized that they go along with half-cocked ideas to celebrate dead icons. When will we see some folks who are living work toward changes that the Rev. Dr. MLK mentioned numerous times throughout his illustrious career?

I propose that we rename Dickerman Street after Edward A. Bouchet. Why do I have a feeling that everyone on this site (including the journalists) have no idea who this man is? Renaming the shortest street in New Haven after him would be considered an insult. For the record, I mentioned this in jest!

We need progressive action, not civil rights band-aids. I mentioned THIS because it needs to become our reality.

Posted by: Al | May 22, 2009 10:07 PM

I like the idea 'Norton Street' put forward ... the connector, once that area is finished, would need a good name, and seeing as the goal of the project is to reconnect neighborhoods ... it might be a great choice for an MLK Boulevard.

Posted by: chingy | May 22, 2009 10:42 PM

the cost to business in renaming an existing address is prohibitive, even if the business' are small. you are talking owner cost to stationary, phone company billing and 911 updates, mapping, land records at city hall, tax records, etc...this is not well planned. as someone mentioned, many new streets have been named recently in new haven, always in the project demolitions and rebuilding at elm haven(monterrey place), and q-terrace. all new street names.

and by the way, new haven already has king st up in the hill...just put a 'ML' on the existing sign. that makes it easy for everyone

Posted by: jackie | May 23, 2009 12:57 PM

i would bet to the contrary that the journalists and certainly editor of the NHI know who bouchet is.

Posted by: Walter Sobchak | May 23, 2009 3:04 PM

If the street is renamed, will anyone call it MLK Blvd? Much like 6th Ave in New York (renamed Ave of the Americas) is still 6th Ave, Whalley Ave will always be Whalley Ave. Adding MLK's name to it is in a way a disservice to two historical figures.

Whalley earned his place in history, let him keep it. Should MLK have a street? Probably, but let it be a new street or a street (such as N. Frontage Rd) that doesn't already have an ingrained and identifiable name.

Posted by: Two2Three | May 24, 2009 12:19 PM

Exactly one year before his assassination, Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.

spoke about ghetto violence at Riverside Church. In that speech King explained his opposition to the U.S. war on Vietnam, a war that left millions of Vietnamese and hundreds of thousands of our young people dead, maimed, or poisoned, a price the two countries are still paying.

"I was increasingly compelled to see the war as an enemy of the poor and to attack it as such."

While that speech has largely been censored by U.S. media and political leaders, it should be required reading when we celebrate Dr. King's birthday every year.

"Now it should be incandescently clear that no one who has any concern for the integrity and life of America today can ignore the present war."

Dr. King was speaking of Vietnam. But it is no leap that to assert that he would draw the same conclusion about our 21st century wars for oil, strategic location and occupation.

"They must see Americans as strange liberators."

Perhaps in calling to name a street after Dr. King, Alderman Shah wishes to acknowledge that

King made the connection between our street violence and our international violence:

"I could never again raise my voice against the violence of the oppressed in the ghettos without having first spoken clearly to the greatest purveyor of violence in the world today: my own government."

Perhaps by calling to name a street after Dr. King, Alderman Shah wishes to tell the people of New Haven and Connecticut that our government should not ride roughshod over the people.

"The only change came from America as we increased our troop commitments in support of governments which were singularly corrupt, inept, and without popular support."

Perhaps Alderman Shah wants to bring to our attention the terrific violence that Dr. King not only spoke but acted against.

"What do the peasants think as we ally ourselves with the landlords and as we refuse to put any action into our many words concerning land reform? What do they think as we test out our latest weapons on them, just as the Germans tested out new medicine and new tortures in the concentration camps of Europe?"

"I speak for those whose land is being laid waste, whose homes are being destroyed, whose culture is being subverted. I speak for the poor of America who are paying the double price of smashed hopes at home, and dealt death and corruption in Vietnam."

Perhaps by naming a street after Dr. King, Alderman Shah would like to remind us that the annual military budget violence draining hundreds of billions of dollars that Dr. King spoke against means inner city jobs not created, schools that fail to educate our children, health care unavailable, presents and futures stolen here and abroad.

"The world now demands a maturity of America that we may not be able to achieve. It demands that we admit that we have been wrong from the beginning of our adventure..."

I'm sure that Alderman Shah wishes that our naming something after Dr. King is not just a token. Let's make sure it has meaning. Let it be a fine reminder of his enormous wisdom and courage. Let it be a reminder of what is owed to those who suffer violence in our names.

"Then we must make what reparations we can for the damage we have done. We must provide the medical aid that is badly needed..."

At home and abroad.

Posted by: residentofnewhaven | May 24, 2009 7:43 PM

To rename Whalley Ave would be to ignore the history of New Haven and the reason why it got that name to begin with. While they're at it why not rename Goffe and Davenport as well????I agree with some of the other thoughts to wait until a new road is built or renaming a street with not historical significance. What benefits will this bring besides confusion and money spent? There are far more important things to do in New Haven rather than spending time renaming streets. Dr. MLK Jr. was and still is a significant part of history, there are other ways to honor his legacy. Why not think of more productive ways to get the point across?

Posted by: bebe1222 | May 24, 2009 8:12 PM

Not to sound demeaning but naming whalley ave. mlk blvd. will be a self-fulfilling joke that Chris Rock once said. "Something always goes down on MLK Blvd. No matter where you are in the country if you;re on MLK-RUN!" I don't think people on this page are AGAINST naming a street after MLK just not Whalley Ave.

Posted by: RealIssues | May 25, 2009 8:21 PM

I've lived in many major cities and all have a street bearing the name MLK & in which violence is a regular occurance!!! How about addressing the real issues of education, employment, crime & the break down of the Black Family????

Posted by: strangerthanfiction | May 26, 2009 7:41 PM

I am against renaming Whalley Ave. to incorporate Dr. King's name. I think Dr. King was a great man who made a tremendous contribution to America. But our history is important -- all of our history. It's a big mistake to wallpaper over the glories of our past with more recent glories. The historical memory of most folks is so short, when we uproot our past to honor the more recent, we are encouraging folks to cast aside the great legacy and individuals that brought us to where we are. The 3 Judges story is one of the great moments in New Haven history. It helped define New Haven as a place of social justice and a place that honored those who held tyrants to the rule of law. There are many things that can be named after Dr. King, but we shouldn't mess with existing streets and structures etc. It dishonors previous generations and undermines our communal identity.

Posted by: Pedro d'Ibazo | June 9, 2009 12:22 AM

Streets should be named for local folks. Why does there need to be an MLK or Kennedy Blvd in every city as a main thoroughfare. Aren't there enough heroes in NH?