New Haven Independent

posted by: Debra Lombard on July 6, 2010  10:39am

I saw thew furniture in those dumpsters. although not the newest or most gorgeous furniture, still very usable and much life left. Is this how we want to spend our tax dollars, throwing out furniture to replace it with new furniture just because there’s more stylish stuff to buy? If the City had sold or given that furniture to the neighborhood, I’d bet it would have been put to good use. I’m sure it could have been shipped to another country for good use as has been done by other institutions in the area.

posted by: Greening of the Mayor's Office on July 6, 2010  10:45am

No Debra, the Decision-makers do not care. City Hall is too big picture and make-it-shiny-new. Other schools have limited interest because, apparently, they can buy new with our (Federal?) tax dollars.  Now, if Gilbane had pulled a truck up to this weekend’s Newhallville cookout, I am pretty sure there would have been a lot of interest in tables, chairs, easels and the like.

posted by: nathan bixby on July 6, 2010  11:10am

amazing but not surprising. I am glad for the sustainability efforts going on in New Haven, some of them led by the city gov’t, but until administrators are trained to leave recycling and reuse decisions to experts AND there are clear policies for vetting these decisions on all projects of this size, we really can’t call this an environmentally friendly city. 

Beyond this, the society at large has all the tools it needs to have these kinds of things end up in the hands of people for whom “pretty well used” is a heck of a lot better than nothing at all—What about the rebuilding needs in Haiti?  We have local people who would make sure these materials get there.  We also have sister city relationships that might use this.  I can’t necessarily blame Wade, or even the City of New Haven for not having these potential systems in place, but events like this are precious opportunities to set them up. Oh, by the way, I am sure it can all be done for a profit- eventually, we just need to start thinking that way.

posted by: Walt on July 6, 2010  11:17am

I recall using old desks from St.  Francis School on Ferry Street when my kids were young.

The City could have (and maybe did)  offer them to the students or area families instead of dumping them, it seems.

posted by: Debbie R on July 6, 2010  11:44am

Does the school system really believe that if they had put the bookcases and other usable furniture out on the curb that they wouldn’t have found new homes?  No, you don’t want the school to look like a tag sale gone wild but why not offer some free stuff to the neighbors who have had to look at this ugly school for years as some form of compensation.
What a waste.

posted by: Morris Cove Islander on July 6, 2010  11:59am

Do I spot tables, chairs or shelves in the dumpsters? I am sure many citizens of New Haven would have been very interested in the stuff now being tossed out and carried to a land fill!

And I spot a bunch of recyclable material (as metal) in the dumpsters. Stuff that is always being pulled out of the bulk trash heaps along the streets. Why was is not announced that there would be something like a citizens’ “tag sale”?

What is the city’s Office of Sustainability doing?
Was it even involved? I bet NO. But we taxpayers pay for trash removal that removed still usable items and an Office of Sustainability that only sustains itself.

What a waste!

posted by: cjzurcher on July 6, 2010  12:13pm

The point is not whether the stuff is “pretty well used” or that “most schools are not requesting secondhand stuff,” the point is that the stuff is perfectly usable by someone and can be recycled instead of being sent to a landfill.

It’s not hard to figure out that in addition to having environmental and social benefits, recycling school furniture can save, or even make, schools money.

Reducing, reusing and recycling can REDUCE waste significantly, and therefore can SAVE money on disposal costs. Money not wasted on disposal can be spent on other things, which is usually an important factor for anyone in this economy.

If an institution is having a problem placing their used furniture somewhere, they can visit a myriad of resources on the web including the Institution Recycling Network, which is one way to find environmentally friendly ways to reuse old office furniture. I’m sure if they contacted someone at the state DEP they could find local recycling efforts and apparently someone in this story was even told of the local Urban Miners.

The Environmental Partnership Program matches unwanted office furniture with non-profit organizations worldwide that are in need of desks, chairs, and cubicles. 1,600 pieces of old Univ. of Notre Dame law school furniture for instance went to Food for the Poor in Jamaica and Haiti through a partnership between Steelcase and IRN.

I wonder if any of the furniture would have been “wanted” by any schools in Haiti. It probably would have been better than some that was crushed in the recent earthquake there.

It’s a shame that the people behind this recent example of selfish waste continue to make excuses for what they did rather than admitting they made a mistake and threw away furniture that would have been more than fine for many people, children, schools who might not have the wherewithal to build a new facility and furnish it with new furniture.

posted by: davec on July 6, 2010  1:43pm

Gilbane doesn’t get it.  They are part of the problem, not part of the solution.

posted by: streever on July 6, 2010  2:05pm

Precisely what I expect from the Mayor. Ironically, I was one of 40 odd people in that school who met with the Mayor because we all cared about recycling and the environment, at his invitation. In response he told us that he was going to expand recycling and appoint a sustainability czar.

I’m sure that if consulted, the new czar wouldn’t have allowed/encourage this.

From this Mayor, I expect lots of talk, pomp, and appointments/extra costs added. However, I don’t expect it all to amount to a hill of beans at the end of the day.

posted by: Jon on July 6, 2010  2:35pm

Unbelievable, even Yale sells off their old crap for next to nothing instead of tossing it. This is good reporting and yet another sad act by our local government.

posted by: Jeffery on July 6, 2010  2:43pm

” no one wanted it.”
Pretty much says it all.
People cannot expect the government to solve every little, perceived, issue.
The stuff is gone. Time to move on.

posted by: nathan bixby on July 6, 2010  3:09pm

@ jeffrey.  Not so simple as that. This is not a little perceive issue but a symptom of a system that needs work to maximize value. I will never forget the catch22 at my daughter’s YMCA camp years ago.  They didn’t offer much in the way of swimming classes one year.  Reason- “no one wants it” Well first they never let anyone know it was being offered, so had low enrollment. So they second time around the didn’t offer it.  We talked to many other parents who complained that it was not being offer.  This seems like a similar situation.  Second, it is not these administrators jobs to hunt around until they find someone (unlike the Y-camp). But it IS the job of the city gov’t to design systems that maximize value to the city and its citizens.  To just say -“too late, the stuff is gone” misses the whole point.

posted by: Alphonse Credenza on July 6, 2010  4:01pm

Ct public schools have in the past offered furniture to the community for sale.  I know, because my family bought a desk and chair in the 1960s when a school was phased out.  And it is still in use. 

Why didn’t these administrators see any revenue for the department here?  Because they simply don’t care about expenditures.  It isn’t their money. 

And, by the way, what company was paid (and how much?) to cart these supplies off premises?  Someone ought to call All American Waste and ask the question.

posted by: Threefifths on July 6, 2010  4:51pm

I hope king John’s CABNIET is in there.

posted by: Ben Berkowitz on July 6, 2010  5:11pm

This sucks. I’m reassured by the fact that everyone who’s posted so far agrees.

School and Gilbane should admit this as a complete fail, adjust for next time and then, Jeffrey, we can move on.

posted by: Boristt on July 6, 2010  5:49pm

Don,t worry the city is going to get all new stuff for the kids to wreck.Al Credenza you said it right they don,t pay for it so why should they care.Somebody,s going to make a lot of money off all that scrap metal,but we can all complain and wright blogs on this computer but its time for a change in NewHaven and stop this madness.

posted by: Bill Saunders on July 6, 2010  6:01pm

Well, it is common knowledge that the New Haven School System doesn’t have a recycling program.  Can I get one of those big bins for my neighborhood?????

posted by: robn on July 6, 2010  7:04pm

Any broken down piece of junk put on a curb in East Rock will be picked up in less than 15 minutes. Why hasn’t the city figured this out? If they put the word out, there would be salvage guys galore. Heck, New Haven may just be the world capital of dumpster diving.

posted by: Joe on July 6, 2010  7:14pm

Warning this is a bit of a rant….Well I might agree with that assessment if I did not have a customer right now looking for 50 locker units.We sell used chairs and school desks all the time. A local school had us remove almost ALL of the furniture that no one else took as a donation. Of course there is not a great market for used school furniture so we are selling it slowly over time and that costs money. But the local school paid us to remove all the furniture. A significant portion of that was recouped by reducing the 30 yard dumpsters required probably by 4 or 5, based on the volume recovered. The point is you can’t just speculate that it will or will not work, you need to run the numbers based on ALL the options. Then if dumpsters are the best option you are at least demonstrating that, but I find it is most often a lack of advance planning that is the limiting factor not the pure economics of it.In short the system is designed for us to not be bothered with the effort.Can the stuff just be offered for free to the public ? Probably not, because then someone has to actually manage it ( gee that’s what WE do.) Think: give somebody $ 600.00 dollars to manage giving away stuff that would have filled two dumpsters and maybe save 600.00 by spending 600.00 I would have done it. But you gotta call me.And not call the day before it has to be removed either, which is a common practice it seems. Not that anyone called anyone, a citizen had to happen by and observe it when it was too late.
Hey it stimulates the local economy - think it needs it ?
Just like when we demolish and dumpster entire buildings. Finally New Haven recently deconstructed one and saved the materials, but we evidently have a ways to go…I first presented the idea of a deconstruction pilot project to New Haven sometime in the 90’s. And now we’ve finally done ONE. It is another version of “we’ll invest in alternative energy as soon as it is no longer lucrative to invest in fossil fuels”. Of course the environmental and long term economic factors are left out ( real “risks” are externalized from their equations in order to justify the activities a la BP - try making nuclear power’s bottom line work if you factor in wages and pension for security guards at the waste disposal site for 10,000 years -it doesn’t work, not that we HAVE a disposal site suitable for 1000 years).Ok I am getting off the track sort of..
Think of all the unemployed people looking for something to do, but I guess sorting furniture is uh…too complicated ? where’s the stimulus money that could compensate the school for all of the extraordinary complications giving away used furniture encompasses ? Let me guess, just putting a sign out saying “free furniture” is a liability issue, would cause traffic problems, would be unfair to people who did not see the sign, would leave a mess, would be inconsistent with the existing policy, would glut the neighborhood used furniture market,  - did I leave out any excuse ?

posted by: Mnemosyne on July 6, 2010  7:47pm

I work for New Haven public schools and don’t have enough bookshelves and chairs.

posted by: will on July 6, 2010  7:59pm

If a municipality, private company, school district, whatever is ever discarding stuff like this go to http://www.wastematch.com  I’ve been on their list for years and have found free stuff a few times from this website.  It’s NYC based but I’m sure this is close enough to be “metro area”  We have plenty of junk in New Haven that could be given away free by the looks of it.

posted by: will on July 6, 2010  8:17pm

NHI could eliminate a lot of the “comments” by just incorporating more articles on the Mayor.  That way the serial commentors wouldn’t always have to be thinking of new ways to slip-in on every subject what a poor job he does.

posted by: L on July 6, 2010  9:05pm

I bet SOMEONE wants and needs this stuff! Get it together and find out, instead of just dumping it. there’s a salvage company in Hamden that might be able to help: urbanminers.com

posted by: Gener on July 6, 2010  9:17pm

What a waste! I’ve found plenty of chairs just like that one on top, put a little work into it, and made look fantastic with some nice stain or paint and cushion. Im sure there are loads of nice things like that in these dumpsters.

posted by: Greening on July 6, 2010  9:20pm

Will, I agree.  This story is incomplete without comment from Smuts or the Sustainability Officer or someone representing the supposed Mayor’s Green Agenda rather than the school board’s spindoctor.

posted by: New Havener on July 6, 2010  9:46pm

I am not sure which non-profits they notified. I run non-profit and I am aware of very agency, company, school that is getting rid of furniture, Yale, United Wa,y Empower New Haven, but never heard of anything from the BOE….

posted by: Morris Cove Mom on July 6, 2010  10:22pm

Will, you’re right.  Not everything in town is his fault.  But this was a bad decision financially.  Even if we leave the green movement of reduce, reuse, recycle out of it, what it comes down to is that we paid for hauling these dumpsters away, when we didn’t have to.

The damaged metal should have been sold to scrapyards, and the rest of the useable items should have been donated to other schools, Goodwill, Salvation Army, Artspace, or for use by the general public.

If we can somehow begin to run this town like a small town, where people care about each other and their town, and take action about helping and joining together, we will have a better community.  We cannot just have our disappointment in the city or the Mayor’s office be the only thing we have in common.

posted by: Robyn Cornwell on July 6, 2010  10:27pm

Do you not know that there is NO AWAY to throw things to??? So-called landfills are FULL in CT and it is TRUCKED to Ohio - how many carbon-emitting miles is that? In addition, stuff thrown away comes back to haunt us in the form of polluted water from the toxins emitted from the so-called “trash”.

Connecticut is the one place that has its collective head in the sand when it comes to sustainability. It’s about time to wake up before it is too late when you will all wonder what happened!

Robyn Cornwell, CSBA
Certified Sustainable Building Advisor

posted by: Charlie O'Keefe on July 6, 2010  11:10pm

What waste. Goodwill would have picked it up for free for the benefit of the poor and disadvantaged. How can the city expect its citizens to recycle if it does this. I am totally disgusted yet again with the DeStefano administration. Only last week there was a story on how buildings were being carefully demolished so they could be reused. Total hypocrisy. The Sustainability Department’s only job is to sustain an incompetent, inefficient administration.

posted by: Pedro Soto on July 7, 2010  9:25am

I agree with Ben, this is one big fail. There wasn’t a single piece of furniture worth saving? It’s institutional laziness at it’s worst.

And of course no one wants “second hand items” with this whole school construction project I’m sure the buildings are getting brand spanking new everything (at taxpayers cost of course)

The city needs to look at deconstruction and reuse as an integral part of city business and not as some sort of exotic activity. This is one of the first places where our “sustainability czar” needs to start. 

Everyone who is interested in reuse and salvage needs to stop by Urban Miners and check out Joe’s operation. The fantastic work he’s doing is ensuring that high-quality building materials stay out of landfills and get reused into existing projects.

Instead of dropping by Home Depot to pick up a new fireplace mantle, for example, pick up a hand-carved 100 year old one for probably the same price.

posted by: streever on July 7, 2010  9:54am

Jeffery,

and yet Urban Miners came on here to post that they really needed 50 lockers for a customer. We all “don’t get it”? when a very well-known local company sells used furniture and can’t keep things in stock, it is mind-blowing that NHPS didn’t spend the 2 minutes to call them and tell them the inventory.

What a shame.

posted by: robn on July 7, 2010  12:51pm

Just to re-emphasize the common-sense procyling that commenters seem to overwhelmingly support, I wonder if the city, readying to demolish a concrete structure, plans on recycling the concrete and rebar? hmmm.

posted by: Vinny G on July 7, 2010  1:26pm

The real icing on the cake is the cost for the new furniture allocated for the new school.  The same supplier has been supplying all the new schools in New Haven.  Whats wrong with this picture?

posted by: Stanford on July 7, 2010  7:30pm

Robn

A savvy contractor pulls the rebar out of concrete and sells it as scrap. They get about $250 to $300 a ton, and its recycled making steel cheaper and reducing pollution.
If they are really good they use the broken up concrete on another job for foundations, or they grind it for aggregate. Cheaper than blasting new rock.

THATS CALLED RECYCLING

As this is a city job it will end up in a landfill. The guys that own landfills are good with political contributions.

THATS CALLED SUSTAINABILITY

posted by: Get over it on July 8, 2010  10:09am

My son went to East Rock Magnet. What a prison that was. The last week of school DURING his awards assembly movers were taking good, usable furniture and loading it on moving trucks to be used at the next site. The tables and chairs and whatever else in the dumpsters BELONG THERE, they were unfit for children to use. That school was a piece of you know what. Thank goodness children don’t have to be taught in that dungeon anymore. As for giving the furniture away or donating it, I wouldn’t let my dog near it, it was that bad. I do however think it should be recycled.

posted by: redworms on July 9, 2010  8:59am

There are many pro-active steps we can take as a City.  It sounds like this is a School District issue and should be approached at this level.

NEW LANGUAGE needs to be added to all new construction or renovation contracts that includes a requirement of reusing materials from and of the building and recycling.  Many other states are requiring 50-80% recovery rates from new construction and renovation projects - we could propose this at a city-wide level or begin to put language in new contracts from the school district.

WE ARE NOT ALONE:  There are companies that provide this service.  Locally we have Goodwill and Urbanminers and many non-profits in need.  But if there is a very large amount of stuff that needs to be quickly - there are companies - like IRN http://www.ir-network.com - that work with institutions (Yale is one of their members/clients) to be able to move large amounts of stuff quickly - distributing locally, nationally and internationally.

Someone mentioned an on-line materials exchange program in NY - we NOW have one in CT!  Just started - for businesses, institutions, non-profits and municipalities (designed to help towns with these issues) - they can be free or for sale.  CT Material Trader http://www.ctmaterialtrader.org 

Has anyone approached or is anyone on their school boards to bring up this angle - working with district on contract language?

posted by: mikeys on July 13, 2010  5:02pm

What a waste! People have no money or jobs- the city should have has a tag sale or offered the contents to the public. It is irresponsible.