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Union Prez Fed Up Over Student Discipline

by Melissa Bailey | Mar 17, 2014 2:14 pm

(44) Comments | Commenting has been closed | E-mail the Author

Melissa Bailey Photo A 1st-grader punches a teacher. The kid gets a talking-to at the principal’s office—then returns to class the next day to cause more trouble.

Versions of that scenario are playing out all too often in city schools, said teachers union President Dave Cicarella (pictured).

Frustrated with what he called a lack of action on the part of the school district, Cicarella broke his silence on a long-running private dispute about school discipline.

Cicarella’s public remarks at a school board meeting last week represented a rare public disagreement between him and the school district administration. Tthe two sides have gained national recognition for a labor-management collaboration and have been at pains to work out disagreements behind closed doors. His remarks took place in a new political landscape, where various groups are testing Garth Harries’ new role as top schools chief.

Cicarella said he broke his silence because he has been privately sparring with Harries over the discipline issue for the past year and he feels nothing is being done.

Too often, he said, kids disrupt class—throwing chairs, punching, biting or hitting teachers—without effective discipline from school administration.

“Why isn’t the student discipline issue more front and center?” he asked. “It impacts everything that we say and do.”

Cicarella said teachers are not being supported, and kids are suffering, too. Families are “home trusting us to make sure that everything is safe,” and “that the classroom is safe and conducive to learning,” but it’s not, he said.

Principals tell teachers “their hands are tied,” and they cannot issue any more suspensions, Cicarella reported. He suggested there is an unofficial quota on suspensions.

The school district’s central office sends the message to principals that “you’ve suspended too many students,” Cicarella charged. So students get sent back to class.

Cicarella said he’s not in favor of simply suspending more kids. But he said the current system isn’t working because students are simply repeating the bad behavior.

Cicarella said the situation stands to threaten the city’s nationally watched effort to improve its schools.

“Nothing’s going to happen if the classroom is not well-managed, well-disciplined,” he said.

“This is a place where Dave and I have a difference of opinion,” Harries replied at the meeting. He doesn’t want to see more kids suspended.

Harries said the district is working to train more teachers and staff in how to better handle the social and emotional issues kids face that cause them to act out in school. He called the discipline issue “complex,” one requiring a range of responses.

Board member Che Dawson asked Cicarella about the magnitude of the problem.

Cicarella didn’t offer citywide numbers. But he said very often, in a class of 25 kids, “you’re going to have four to five causing disruptions.”

When they return to class, other students see that that student was not disciplined, so they come to understand that there are no consequences for acting out, Cicarella said.

JoAnne Wilcox, a parent activist who recently formed a task force that will advise district policy on school discipline, rose to redirect the conversation. Wilcox strongly opposes suspending and expelling kids. That pushes away the kids who need the most help, she argued.

She called for the school system to implement “restorative justice” programs, which are emerging as an alternative to suspending kids and kicking them out. The programs focus on helping kids develop empathy and make reparations for the harm they have done instead of simply receiving punishment. In some programs, schools bring in babies to help students develop empathy, Wilcox offered.

“We do not want kids put out of school,” Cicarella later agreed. “It’s not good to send kids home on a regular basis.”

He suggested schools employ full-time social-workers and guidance counselors—staff who are trained specialists in helping kids with trauma and emotional needs—to help with disruptive kids. Some schools have used money from United Way’s BOOST! program to hire “drama therapists” to run groups and counsel kids; however, those therapists have disappeared from schools when the BOOST! startup money dries up.

Cicarella said administrators are often too “busy with a million other things” to give disruptive kids the attention and support they need.

“We need people who are trained to talk to these kids,” he said.

Cicarella said teachers are seeing more severe behavior problems in the schools. Kids as young as grades K to 2 are punching, hitting teachers and tipping over chairs, he said.

“Teachers are to the point where it’s like, I can’t teach.”

Cicarella led New Haven to become one of the first school districts in the nation to grade teachers based on how their students perform.

Teachers “need to be accountable for student learning,” he said. “But we have to put them in a position where they can be successful. And we don’t.” The lack of support from central office, he said “unfairly targets the teacher and reflects on their evaluation.”

Harries: Address “At All Levels’

Harris Sunday argued that “our leaders and teachers generally do a good job” dealing with classroom misbehavior, but “challenges persist and there is no easy solution.”

“When a child has acted out in school, it’s our job both to protect the learning environment by minimizing classroom disruption and to support the mis-behaving child and find ways to engage him or her in his own education. We have never limited suspensions in schools – but whenever a suspension happens, we do want to be sure it’s an appropriate and learning-based response for the student concerned.  I would certainly like the district to move away from zero-tolerance discipline strategies, which don’t contemplate the learning that students do in a situation and which research shows do not actually reduce behavioral problems.”

Harries described a range of responses: “Teachers should get more training and take more responsibility for the personal development issues that underlie many behavior challenges; more specialists like social workers and therapists in schools should help students address the trauma and other root causes of bad behavior; and students who have been removed from the classroom should have stronger and more educational settings in which they can refocus their behavior.  We have been working on all these issues, but have much further to go – and every action will take resources of time, money, and partnership to do well.”

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posted by: Smithers on March 17, 2014  3:00pm

What a tough situation to have to deal with.  African American students (boys) are suspended at a rate that greatly exceeds all other groups.  On the other hand, there is no way that I could tolerate this behavior in a classroom that my children attend.  I’m stumped…

posted by: connecticutcontrarian on March 17, 2014  3:43pm

Where was the outrage from the Teachers Union when funding for support staff (e.g. nurses and social workers) was being slashed from the budget? Many of the professionals who are capable of identifying and preventing these disruptions have either been removed from the schools or are only there on a part time basis. This coupled with the ballooning size of the school-to-prison pipeline creates a problem that impacts all involved.

it’s time to stop the “us versus them” approach and figure out how all stakeholders can come together to support. Kids are coming to school with intense emotional and economic challenges that teachers are simply not equipped to handle. The Comer method is great, but the time has come for a more intense focus on therapeutic treatment and assessment that will helps kids in crisis.

posted by: HewNaven on March 17, 2014  3:53pm

Anybody who thinks there’s a simple, one-size-fits-all solution to the complicated issue of ‘student discipline’ is being naive or facetious. There are no easy answers. We can make policy guidelines but still each student discipline case should be assessed independently.

posted by: Threefifths on March 17, 2014  4:09pm

Give Me a break.I am sick and tired of the Blame the teacher B.S.Look disruptive behavior leads to conflicts in the classroom and halts the learning process.Unfortunately, teachers do not have a remote control to their students,thus they cannot always stop bad behavior.Children are fairly sneaky when it comes to staying out of trouble while one misbehaving child can often generate a domino effect. As such, teachers cannot always cope with or recognize bad behavior, though they are usually at the center of blame when the misdeeds of students turn ugly.Meanwhile, school administrations have a tendency of exasperating these issues by blaming teachers through their responses. With bad grades and misbehavior comes extra work for teachers and stricter requirements mainly affecting teachers. If a new school program is introduced, the burden is laid upon the teachers. Through policy changes, administers are taking out the failure of their schools, students, and parents solely on the teachers. In contrast, administrators need to work with teachers versus looking at teachers as the source of all evil.There are a lot of issues with the American primary education system. As a rule, teachers are the ones who feel the brunt of this frustration when it comes to the underlying issues. One consequence, which results from this factor, is the unwarranted attacks that are sure to generate resistance to change. Where teachers are told they alone need to keep giving, cooperation will fail.So it starts at home.Part One.

posted by: Threefifths on March 17, 2014  4:15pm

Part two.Letter a teacher wrote.

As a teacher, I am responsible for educating all of my students regardless of race, gender, religion, etc. So why do teachers deserve disrespect and, more important, why do students deserve to have their education taken away by another student’s misbehavior?
I have been threatened on more than one occasion, and parents seem to think this is acceptable (telling me that I was “picking on” their child). I am expected to control a student’s behavior seeing him one hour a day, and expected to be threatened and disrespected by a minor. My only option is to document the incident and put the situation in the hands of administration. I do not have the time to interrupt my class and the learning of my students for behavior issues.
I am preparing students for a career or college, and I don’t know of one option that would tolerate an individual disrespecting others. Employers don’t care about race or difficult personal situations at home; if someone is disrespectful or threatening, he is fired. Our society must make individuals responsible for their behavior regardless of race - and for minors that responsibility must lie with the parents.
We must get serious about educating our children, and those students who don’t want the opportunity are only holding back the ones that do. Perhaps our zero-tolerance policy should have a limit, and those students kicked out of public schools would be forced to pay for private education. Parents accept responsibility when it hits them in the pocket.
SHALA SHEIDLER

posted by: darnell on March 17, 2014  4:18pm

Take them out of the classroom, immediately, to a setting where they can be dealt with. If the problem is reoccurring, force their parents to come in and deal with it, isn’t that their jobs.

Do NOT suspend them, all you are doing is giving them a free vacation day, what punishment is that. Suspension should only be used for those that are a danger to their classmates and teachers.

posted by: cedarhillresident! on March 17, 2014  4:41pm

3/5th nailed it!

posted by: Threefifths on March 17, 2014  5:28pm

How many of you rememeber these Little Darlings.

Making The Bus Monitor Cry.

http://youtu.be/l93wAqnPQwk

posted by: OccupyTheClassroom on March 17, 2014  5:44pm

Having a paraprofessional in hard to manage classrooms helps a lot. I’d like to have a full time one for 1 period a day. It would allow me to handle situations by taking kids out and talking to them one on one and/or calling home right then and there. This is a very effective use of resources AND cuts down on the student to adult ratio.

posted by: heightster70 on March 17, 2014  5:49pm

Why does no one acknowledge the pink elephant in the room. Not once did I read the word “PARENTS” in the article. Don’t make them if you can’t raise them properly.

posted by: Brutus2011 on March 17, 2014  5:52pm

Hooray, NHFT management finally comes out with it: Student behavior is out of control and teachers get the blame.

This is true with a capitol T.

And, Harries response as outlined in the last paragraph is telling as to why this situation exists and why it will continue unabated.

1. Harries said, “Teachers should get more training and take more responsibility for the personal development issues that underlie many behavior challenges”
  Are you kidding me? Teachers should take more responsibility for students personal development issues? Teachers are NOT parents!

2. Harries said, “more specialists like social workers”
  Are you kidding me? Get more community members trained as paraprofessionals (at Gateway CC) and just watch how behaviors change plus people will have jobs

3. Harries said, “students who have been removed from the classroom should have stronger and more educational settings in which they can refocus their behavior”
  Are you kidding me? If a kid cannot learn to control his behavior with parental involvement then it is out and let the parents find (and pay) for their schooling…and watch how fast behaviors change if people’s pocketbooks get threatened.

Look, folks this is where the rubber meets the road and where we all need to stop the profiling and cow-pucky and for once address this issue honestly and in a straight forward manner. We get a handle on this and New Haven really will be a nationally recognized example of effective school reform. Otherwise, it is all smoke and mirrors and status quo at any cost—our kid’s futures.

posted by: NewHaven06513 on March 17, 2014  6:59pm

3/5 Great points! People these are not disruptive kids… These kids are Out of Control and have serious issues. The time spent dealing with them takes away from the vast majority of our kids. Some kids need serious professional help and need special schools who have the staff and support to deal with these kids.  Due to their classification they are special ed and fall under federal laws… These laws need to amended so that they can get help and not be labeled. While also protecting the educational process and keeping our kids safe.

posted by: robn on March 17, 2014  7:50pm

So could we have fewer people kicked upstairs into high paid assistant principal jobs and more people with expertise in the trenches to help out with sort of thing?

posted by: Threefifths on March 17, 2014  8:30pm

To Garth Harries.How can teachers get a fair evaluations under these conditions.

posted by: Gretchen Pritchard on March 17, 2014  9:46pm

“If a kid cannot learn to control his behavior with parental involvement then it is out and let the parents find (and pay) for their schooling ... “

Sorry, Brutus 2011, that’s not an option. 

Every child has a RIGHT to a FREE public education. 

The Republicans haven’t managed to take that “entitlement” away yet.  Give them time, I suppose; they’re certainly working on it.

posted by: Teacher671 on March 18, 2014  7:03am

I think the superintendent is missing the point here.  It is not that teachers do not want to educate these students. If they’re acting out to this degree how much can they be learning as it is? And what about the rest of the students who have their learning disrupted? Also, we are not talking about regular child misbehavior.  The teacher is and should be responsible for maintaining order and enforcing classroom rules But there are many students with emotional needs that are not being met and this often causes extreme behaviors that are often violent.  These behaviors need more intervention than a classroom teacher can provide alone.  There needs to be consequences that can only be enforced at the administrative level.  I do not think suspensions are usually the answer- the students need to be working and learning and they will not do that at home.  But there needs to be consequences and a plan of action (appropriate counseling etc) for students who continuously have these problems.  The teacher can not do this alone.  I once had to ask a passerby to evacuate my class because a student had become so agitated and violent.  Half the class was crying.  It took 20 minutes to get him to the office and and he came back 5 minutes later with a sticker and new pencil.  I’ve heard similar stories from others.  This is not fair to any one including the student who is acting out.

posted by: joshmoejo on March 18, 2014  8:00am

While I’m loving my new tittle “parent activist”, I want to be clear that I’m not hogging that role. I’m always happy to share. And as long as I’m sharing (and you’ve read this far in the comments, so I’m assuming you’re interested), I’d also love to share what I’m learning. 25 years of zero tolerance policies has failed our city. So, I started thinking about what we can do to replace them. The three questions I led with were “what works in cities like ours?”, “how was it implemented?”, and “how did they pay for it?”  In doing that, I’ve found myself excited about the alternatives, because they’re out there, and they’re working!  Look into it for your schools.
I believe that all of the kids will benefit from knowing that there’s a dignified response for when things go wrong. All kids are watching as we throw some kids to the curb, and they know that’s not helping. If we had tools, and modeled how to use them, they’re watching that too. Parents, teachers, and administrators. No more throwing stones.  Let’s work together to find the solutions that will work in our schools with our kids. It’s a slow course, but it’s the right course.
Time to do your homework!

posted by: Christopher Schaefer on March 18, 2014  1:54pm

Cicarella: “Why isn’t the student discipline issue more front and center?” Answer: political correctness. “the current system isn’t working because students are simply repeating the bad behavior… When they return to class, other students see that that student was not disciplined, so they come to understand that there are no consequences for acting out”. Does this remind anyone besides me of the city’s dirt bike problem? The “official” message: “Don’t ride dirt bikes in public streets.” The REAL message: “We’re not going to do anything about it, so actually you can go right ahead and ride dirt bikes in public streets.” “Harries said the district is working to train more teachers and staff in how to better handle the social and emotional issues kids face that cause them to act out in school.” And HERE we arrive at the issue no one wants to acknowledge: our public schools have morphed into substitute parents. Harries obviously supports this development: “Teachers should get more training and take more responsibility for the personal development issues”.  And as long as REAL parents continue to hand over this responsibility to the schools, NOTHING will change: schools, neighborhoods, society, culture… Threefifths: “it starts at home”. Shala Sheidler: “Our society must make individuals responsible for their behavior regardless of race - and for minors that responsibility must lie with the parents.” Amen.

posted by: Interesting thought on March 18, 2014  2:29pm

So sad how we blame the teachers. I am a parent of 2 children. Each day on the way to school I gave my little speech as we drove up to school. After awhile, they knew it word for word…verbatim.

-Respect all those that you come into contact with. From the floor washer to the principal. And everyone in between. No exceptions.

-Your teachers went to school and earned degrees to teach you, NOT to babysit. Do not waste their valuable time. Or that of the other students. If you want to behave like a baby, we can bring the crib up from the basement & throw you back in diapers.

-Mouths shut…minds, eyes and ears open.

-Learn your lessons and earn your marks.

-if these rules are not adhered to, there WILL be hell to pay!

Never had a stitch of trouble out of my kids.

posted by: just my 2 cents on March 18, 2014  2:42pm

To the powers of the Educational system..here is my 2 cents about it all..

Some parents do not want to be reminded or told how to educate or instill discipline into their child when they know their child has issues..(if your child has issues or your family.. get the help you need.)

To the teacher’s.. stop making excuses for ineffectiveness. If you know a child will have behavior issues since day one in the class room. ask for the help..(paraprofessional or other support staff).

Leadership,Policy Makers, and the Community..
It’s time to stop sugarcoating this.. we have a very serious problem that is on all schools..Neighborhood and Magnet Schools..Let’s get this done to fix the problem. If you(the School System need help) hire the help that is needed. Most tax payers would not mind the use of their tax dollars going into a program that benefits jobs and a chance to get this problem controlled.
If you know that you need more security gurads, In-house personal,Truancy or other Support Staff to help you.. hire them.. I am sure that their are enough Substitute Teachers who are looking to stop working for a sub-par wage and want to make a difference with a real liveable wage. Hire and promote from within to make the changes that is needed..
thats just my two cents.. more to come..

posted by: Threefifths on March 18, 2014  5:35pm

I bet just like in New York.This will be happing
Here in this state if not already.

NYC teachers heading to suburbs for higher pay, better working conditions.

http://www.uft.org/news/nyc-teachers-heading-suburbs-higher-pay-better-working-conditions

posted by: cp06 on March 18, 2014  6:25pm

THIS sounds like the perfect opportunity to identify and funnel children who need significant extra attention into an environment that provides it…a choice not offered on the “True Vote” provided. If these children can be identified, especially when they are young, why not provide social, behavioral and emotional supports in addition to education? We know what happens if we don’t. And to those who say that the parents aren’t doing it, should be—it doesn’t matter because we know what the results will be if these children do NOT get what they need, whether they are not getting it from their parents or not getting it from us.

posted by: Christopher Schaefer on March 18, 2014  7:09pm

If parents can’t do the job, then a different social agency needs to be called upon—not the school system. For example: http://bbbsswct.org/

posted by: new havener on March 18, 2014  7:38pm

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/09/us/us-criticizes-zero-tolerance-policies-in-schools.html?_r=0

It’s clear the teachers, Cicarella, Harries, and the city of new haven are in trouble. Read the above…how can you succeed in a struggle to educate when you have the hand of discipline tied behind your back?

Can you blame any teacher for not staying in an inner-city environment, where they are judged on performance, but can’t remove disciplinary issues?

posted by: Interesting thought on March 18, 2014  8:38pm

Okay, so let’s throw money at the problem and not prevent the problems?

I have an idea, some of you may disagree vehemently. Parents should be held responsible for the actions of their children. Plain and simple. Get rid of the kids who are disrupting the classroom. It prevents others from learning. For those parents who receive welfare, make parenting classes a requirement of receiving aid. From birth. How about making those same parents who don’t work, come in and volunteer during the school day. Instead of dropping junior off to wreak havoc on their respective classrooms. Our tax dollars should not be feeding disinterested, lazy parents and wayward students. Enough is enough. It’s not fair to the kids who WANT to learn and to the teachers who have decided to become educators. How can they teach to students who haven’t been parented?

posted by: Interesting thought on March 18, 2014  8:58pm

@ Gretchen, you are absolutely RIGHT! All children deserve a free education. What about the students who lose out on education because of the miscreants who cause trouble? What about their rights? Do t the well behaved and prepared socially students deserve a solid education?

posted by: Teachergal on March 18, 2014  10:32pm

Harries described a range of responses: “Teachers should get more training and take more responsibility for the personal development issues that underlie many behavior challenges; more specialists like social workers and therapists in schools should help students address the trauma and other root causes of bad behavior; and students who have been removed from the classroom should have stronger and more educational settings in which they can refocus their behavior.  We have been working on all these issues, but have much further to go – and every action will take resources of time, money, and partnership to do well.”


Blah, blah, blah,,,,,obviously Harries has never been hit by a student, had a chair thrown at him or been verbally abused by a student.

posted by: Jim Berger on March 18, 2014  10:40pm

People should read the link to the restorative justice article JoAnne Wilcox posted.  I read it and was very moved and impressed.  It sounds possible.  The school behavior problems are not going to be solved by depriving kids of schooling; nor by insisting that overstressed parents who are barely (or not) holding things together suddenly just get their kids in line—like we competent people do.  So: I suggest, read JoAnne’s link.  It’s really illuminating.  Then continue the discussion, maybe on somewhat different terms.

posted by: Threefifths on March 19, 2014  8:28am

Do like they do in the U.K.

Parents face fines if pupils behave badly
Ed Balls outlines new powers for courts over children who fail to abide by their school’s rules.

Parents of children who regularly behave badly in class could be hauled before the courts under wide-ranging government school reforms to be unveiled this week.Court-backed parenting orders could be imposed on families who refuse to co-operate with teachers over disciplining their children. A parenting order requires parents to take specific steps to control a child’s behaviour - including attending parenting courses or counselling sessions, ensuring their children are at home at a certain time, or avoiding certain situations and people. Failure to comply could lead to parents being fined or given a community sentence.

http://www.theguardian.com/education/2009/jun/28/fines-pupil-bad-behaviour

posted by: JohnTulin on March 19, 2014  11:09am

...and NHPS Teachers are supposed to be fairly evaluated under these circumstances?  Is that possible?  A perfect storm is approaching Urban Education. 

It is not the school’s job to raise your kids, parents.  JoAnne Wilcox, this should be a conversation between parents who can’t control their kids, include the kids - figure it out.  If you can’t get your kid together, how is a teacher who sees them (as one in a large group) for 45 minutes a day?!?

posted by: Lao ri on March 19, 2014  12:12pm

You can’t just tell kids there are doing something wrong, unless
you can show them something better.
Discipline and the current system doesn’t work as is evidenced by all the existing problems to date.
Instead of discipline, show them something better, so they won’t feel like they are giving up anything, they
will just go the the better path if it’s properly explained.
That takes more thought.
Parents lack child raising knowledge, and many incorrectly depend on the schools to provide what they lack.
If it’s not good for them at home, then it won’t be good anywhere else.
Problems start at home.
Ask not what your schools can do for you, but what you can do for your kids.

posted by: Interesting thought on March 19, 2014  2:15pm

@Lao ri,

And THIS is why people are fleeing the system. Choosing private over public. Because why should my child suffer for the rights of the others? It’s just not fair. So glad my child is at the end of senior year.

Just a question, do you have kids? If so, which grades? What type of educational setting? Are there issues? Do your children have to sit and wait for teachers to control the wild animal behavior? If not, then you may not be able to speak to this issue.

And parents must be held accountable. This B.S. talk about them not having the skills…yada yada yada…is Crap. if you tell them that their welfare is in jeopardy, they will conform and take hold of their unruly hellions.

posted by: rozzyteach on March 19, 2014  4:44pm

I am a New Haven teacher. I deal with out of control students every day. The students are completely aware that if they curse at a teacher, hurt another student or disrupt the class, NOTHING will happen! The principals are too afraid to suspend because they are scared of Central Office. So they get sent back into the classroom where the majority of students are not getting an education because of these students. Some days I spend most of my day dealing with discipline issues instead of educating the ones who want to learn. It is totally unfair to them. I am not a trained therapist. I am an educator. The parents need to step up and provide discipline in the home so we can educate them.

posted by: FHResident on March 20, 2014  7:50am

There is no reason whatsoever that a teacher should deal with the bad behavior disrespectful attitude of any student as well as the parent. If a student is having a tempertrantrum , behavior outrage, no the teacher nor the other students should suffer the consequence of what I say would be an issue that further involves family services, special need and or behavioral treatment.  The parents should immediately be called discuss the issue and have a meeting with principal , guidance, social work and teacher if it becomes an on going issue. Bottom line there’s needs to be team work.  When a child act out throwing chairs bottom line acting violent usually there’s is something going on in the home and it is not being addressed! I’m a criminal justice major and I have seen cases like this often and truly is a home environment issue. It is not normal for kids to act out. When things start flying in a class or any where person peoples lives are at stake they can hurt and then the lawsuits begin.  Board of Ed takes a risk allowing these types of behavior by putting the teachers and students in danger.  As a parent I would be pretty angry if a student acted out and threw an object and my child got hurt!! Who’s responsible!! Not the the teacher if she’s asked for help and no one comes to the rescue… I’m really going to consider Home Schooling… These reports are beginning to sound scary!!

posted by: Interesting thought on March 20, 2014  8:15am

Here’s an other crazy, wacky, idea. When the classroom is so bizarrely disruptive & the civilized children can’t learn(remember, they HAVE rights too), how about their parents start to file class action law suits against the school system! I bet a few expensive lawsuits would get the attention of the folks downtown….AND FAST!

CNN, FOX, MSNBC would all pick up on it and run..NHPS would be mortified by the national coverage…I bet change would happen quicker than a punch could be thrown. I’m no lawyer, but I would be crazy enough to get a few parents together to get the ball rolling if this were the case in my child’s school.

How many of these principals have their kids in these zoos?(oops, I mean classrooms).

@FHRRESIDENT,

How can you collaborate with parents who don’t care? Please, don’t be naive and idealistic to think that these parents will take the time & energy to bring about change. Unfortunately, the only thing that will get their attention is their welfare benefits being taken away.

posted by: Threefifths on March 20, 2014  10:19am

posted by: Interesting thought on March 20, 2014 8:15am

How can you collaborate with parents who don’t care? Please, don’t be naive and idealistic to think that these parents will take the time & energy to bring about change. Unfortunately, the only thing that will get their attention is their welfare benefits being taken away.

So what should we take away from the Rich Kids who do the same thing in school.

The Problem With Rich Kids
In a surprising switch, the offspring of the affluent today are more distressed than other youth. They show disturbingly high rates of substance use, depression, anxiety, eating disorders, cheating, and stealing. It gives a whole new meaning to having it all.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/201310/the-problem-rich-kids

posted by: Interesting thought on March 20, 2014  12:13pm

Not sure what those kids have to do with ours…

Not trying to discount the issues of the offspring of the well heeled, but we are talking about kids here in NH. All the students that I know are bussed to the suburbs have NO issues with behavior in the classrooms. If the suburbs are so bad, why are teachers leaving this school district & migrating to the surrounding areas?

And not for nothing, those parents can afford rehab, understand the importance of psycho therapy…etc.

And last I checked, the dropout rates in the suburbs lag far behind ours.

posted by: JohnTulin on March 20, 2014  12:42pm

3/5….stay on topic. 

But since you made the comparison.  Better off students have issues, that is obvious.  Their issues will be there undoing unless they get it together, obviously.  Their issues don’t disrupt the learning of all others, ruin a class environment or that of the entire building (see: Cross), nor highjack the culture of education in the whole district - which I guess isn’t obvious to you.

posted by: Interesting thought on March 20, 2014  1:04pm

&3/5

I don’t think I ever mentioned students who are better off…I think you are mistaken.

posted by: Threefifths on March 20, 2014  4:01pm

osted by: Interesting thought on March 20, 2014 1:04pm

&3/5

I don’t think I ever mentioned students who are better off…I think you are mistaken.

You made these statement. you tell them that their welfare is in jeopardy, they will conform and take hold of their unruly hellions.Unfortunately, the only thing that will get their attention is their welfare benefits being taken away.

How do you know they are on welfare?


posted by: JohnTulin on March 20, 2014 12:42pm

3/5….stay on topic.

But since you made the comparison.  Better off students have issues, that is obvious.  Their issues will be there undoing unless they get it together, obviously.  Their issues don’t disrupt the learning of all others, ruin a class environment or that of the entire building (see: Cross), nor highjack the culture of education in the whole district - which I guess isn’t obvious to you.

I am on topic.I was talking about the Stereotype statement made By Interesting thought when he or she said the only thing that will get their attention is their welfare benefits being taken away.

I know teachers who teacher in the suburbs and they told me things are sweep under the tables.Remember Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold.The call themselves the Trench Coat Mafia.if you do not read this.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/325054.stm

How come suburb schools have a high rate of using firearms in schools.Stop reading the Bell Curve.

posted by: Interesting thought on March 20, 2014  6:08pm

No stereotypes at all… You and I both know that the majority of kids who are educated by the NHPS receive free/reduced lunch. This issue has nothing to do with “better” off students in the suburbs.

I’m done with this article/subject anyways and will no longer get email notifications…take care.

posted by: Threefifths on March 20, 2014  8:22pm

posted by: Interesting thought on March 20, 2014 6:08pm

No stereotypes at all… You and I both know that the majority of kids who are educated by the NHPS receive free/reduced lunch. This issue has nothing to do with “better” off students in the suburbs.

I’m done with this article/subject anyways and will no longer get email notifications…take care.

Free lunch is based on income levels,You can be unemployment and collecting unemployment and get free lunch based on this income level for your children.Keep reading the Bell Curve.


My bad.

Welfare: A White Secret
By Barbara Ehrenreich  

http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,156084,00.html

posted by: joshmoejo on March 21, 2014  2:22pm

“We must imagine that our futures are connected.”
—John Paul Lederach

http://www.onbeing.org/program/art-peace/182

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