Ideat Village Jury Sides With Police

Markeshia Ricks PhotoA jury decided Friday that Betsy Segui was within the scope of her duties as a police officer to arrest Ideat Village co-founder Bill Saunders for interfering, inciting a riot, and disorderly conduct at a downtown concert.

Jurors made that decision after a couple of hours of deliberation Friday at state Superior Court on Church Street and after viewing evidence and two days of testimony of people who were present on that day of the arrest including Saunders and Segui.

The case came down to whether Segui had probable cause to arrest Saunders on June 30, 2012. Saunders filed a civil suit alleging that Segui had falsely arrested him on that day and had battered him in the process of that arrest. (The charges of interfering, inciting to riot and disorderly were eventually dropped when Saunders instead pleaded guilty to creating a public disturbance, an infraction.) His arrest took place during an event called Ideat Village that Saunders used to stage on Pitkin Plaza off Orange Street an alternative to the International Festival of Arts & Ideas.

City Assistant Corporation Counsel Michael Wolak, who represented Segui, said he was obviously happy with the outcome.

“I also think that Sgt. Segui was forceful in her testimony,” he said.

Saunders was, of course, disappointed with the outcome but he said he believed that the process had been fair.

“That’s all you can ask for,” he said. “That you get your shot. I don’t really understand the verdict but I hope it doesn’t continue to embolden the police department and their poor practices regarding the community.”

Wolak had urged the jurors in his closing statements Friday to pay attention to the evidence, including Segui’s police report, which he noted that she’d written at a point when she was not being sued. He pointed out that by Segui’s own testimony, had Saunders produced a permit for the festival he would have ended the need to investigate the noise complaint that day. (Unaware that the festival had received a permit, she asked Saunders to show he had one; he didn’t have one on him at the moment and couldn’t immediately retrieve it.)

“They never stopped the music,” Wolak said. “They never took any action to shut this down. They let Mr. Saunders leave the venue to try to find the permit.”

He noted that it was Saunders’ choice to make an announcement about the police encounter to the crowd. Saunders has said that he jokingly suggested that if the police couldn’t wait for Shea, then they might have to arrest a lot of people that night. Segui said Saunders actually told the festival goers to attack the officers and go to jail if he was arrested that night. Some in the crowd booed, Segui said.

“Why did he feel it was necessary to go to the microphone that point,” Wolak asked the jurors. “There had been no threat made to arrest him at this point. He admitted that Sgt. Segui had taken no action to shut the venue down.”

Though Saunders said it had been a joke, Wolak said it wasn’t a joke to the two officers who were outnumbered by the nearly 70 people gathered there. And still, officers did not approach Saunders after his announcement; he approached them, Wolak said.

He said by Saunders’ own testimony he never had medical treatment for his injuries. And despite his need to be available within 24 hours for trial, he managed to go to Germany with his band three and a half weeks after the incident.

“Consider that the person in this courtroom who had to receive medical treatment was Betsy Segui,” Wolak said to jurors. “In fact, she was out on workman’s compensation as a result of her contact.”

Saunders’ attorney, Chris DeMarco, told jurors in his closing statement that their decision was important because “it affects everybody” and “deals with bigger issues.”

“It deals with basic civil liberties,” he said. “It deals with freedoms that we’ve all grown accustomed to. Freedoms that were violated.”

“This should have never happened,” DeMarco argued. “It simply should never have happened.”

DeMarco called what happened in the last few hours of the last day of the very last Idea Village Festival was the messy result of a misunderstanding on Segui’s part about Bill Saunders, whom he described as a “gadfly” and “pain in the ass of the powers that be in the city who wasn’t going away.” He also suggested that the arrest resulted from a lack of any attempt by Segui to actually investigate a noise complaint that drew officers to the scene in the first place. He said Segui had no probable cause to arrest Saunders that day and thus falsely arrested him.

And the missing permit? DeMarco told jurors that it was simply a red herring in the absence of any statute or ordinance that requires that it be on the premises of the festival in the first place. Despite everything that happened that day, the police never actually shut the festival down, he noted.

DeMarco urged the jurors to send the City of New Haven a message that the way Segui made the arrest and how Saunders was handled during that arrest won’t be excused or condoned, by awarding him damages in the amount of $25,000.

“We’re not trying to be greedy here,” DeMarco said. “There are police cases … that warrant a hell of a lot more money than this.”

DeMarco said the case wasn’t about money.

“It’s about what’s right and wrong, it’s about being safe and keeping safe,” he said. “It’s about freedom.”

Cop On Stand: “We Never Got That Far”

Betsy Segui testified that if Bill Saunders had readily produced an event permit six years ago for the Ideat Village festival he organized in Pitkin Plaza, she’d never have arrested him.

“If everything was in order, I would have thanked him for his cooperation and radioed to dispatch to ask if the complainant wanted to speak to an officer,” she said.

Segui made that admission Thursday during the second day of testimony in the trial.

After listening to testimony from Saunders and his witnesses the day before, jurors in the courtroom at 235 Church St. Thursday got to hear from Segui about how her responding to a noise complaint ended with Saunders in handcuffs. (Read about the first day of the first day’s court proceedings here.)

The jurors also got to listen to the 911 call that brought Segui and her former partner Matthew Marcinczyk to Pitkin Plaza that day, hear the transmissions between Segui and the dispatcher, and view the video of Saunders’ eventual arrest.

Segui testified Thursday that on the day in question, she was working B squad, from 4 p.m. to midnight. A patrol officer at the time, she was just two years outside of having completed all of the probationary requirements of becoming an officer. She responded to a call that someone living at 360 State. had called to complain of noise coming from the adjacent Pitkin Plaza.

The caller, who only identified himself as “David,” told the dispatcher that there was music so loud coming from downstairs that he “couldn’t hear himself think.” He told the dispatcher that the music had been loud all week. Segui and Marcinczyk arrived at the scene in separate cars at about 8:19 p.m.

Prior to that day, she had never heard of the festival, which had been running for years. No one in the department told her it was permitted.

When she arrived she was unaware that it had been going on all week and was in fact just a couple of hours shy of closing out its last day. The festival traditionally ran concurrently with the International Festival of Arts & Ideas, which was happening just blocks away at the New Haven Green.

Segui said she immediately asked a man who was working the soundboard who was in charge. The man pointed out Saunders. Saunders previously testified that someone had tapped him on the shoulder and alerted him to police presence. He made his way over to the officers.

There’s little dispute about what happened next. The officers met with Saunders and let him know that they’d been asked to look into a noise complaint and needed to see his permit. He didn’t have it on him because his festival partner, Nancy Shea, who he thought was around the corner setting up a gallery space for an after party later that night on Court Street, had it. He went off to get the permit from Shea and was gone for about 15 minutes.

The officers didn’t accompany him to get the permit. They didn’t threaten to arrest him, and they didn’t shut down the festival. They waited.

When Saunders returned to Pitkin Plaza, he was empty-handed. He tells the officers he couldn’t find Shea but he was trying to reach her.

What Saunders did next also isn’t in dispute. While a band continued to play, he went to the mic and made an announcement alerting the crowd to the officers’ presence and their desire to see the festival permit. He told festival goers that the event was permitted and Nancy Shea would bring it.

But what he said next is very much in dispute.

Divergent Tales

Saunders has said that he jokingly suggested that if the police couldn’t wait for Shea, then they might have to arrest a lot of people that night. Segui said Thursday that in fact Saunders actually told the festival goers to attack the officers and go to jail if he was arrested that night. Some in the crowd booed, Segui said.

With about 70 people in the plaza, Segui and Marcinczyk didn’t take Saunders’ words lightly. The jurors got to listen to Segui call the dispatcher to say officers would shut down the festival because Saunders couldn’t produce the permit.

They also got to listen to dispatch communications of Segui twice asking for first a district manager and then a shift supervisor and eventually additional units to come to the scene. The backup never arrived.

A supervisor eventually came to Chapel Street, where the officers would ultimately bring Saunders.

Segui testified that when Saunders got off the mic he quickly made his way over to the officers. She described him as red-faced, hands clenched, waving his finger directly at her and then yelling specifically at her. She said he was moving toward her in such a way that she had to take a step back and demand that he stop coming toward her or she was going to arrest him.

Saunders stopped, Segui said, ultimately pivoting as if he were going to make his way back to the mic. He was commanded not to leave at risk of arrest. Saunders allegedly started to run away from the officers. That’s when Segui and Marcinczyk each grabbed one of his arms.

“He does not get far,” she said. “And what he does is dead his weight so that he falls forward and then all three of us go to the ground.”

Saunders alleged that the officers tackled him with both of them landing on top of him. He testified that he locked an arm around one of Segui’s legs to keep his head from being bashed into the brick pavers of the plaza, resulting in the head injury he suffered and the scrapes he received on his arms and legs.

Segui testified Thursday that Saunders locked both his arms around her leg and she was hitting his arm, punching him in the head and pulling his hair to make him turn her loose and submit to being handcuffed. They eventually get Saunders cuffed but both officers were injured in the process.

By this time people in the crowd were outraged by Saunders’ treatment. In a video shown to the jurors, officers finally stood him up. People could be heard shouting. Someone could clearly be heard asking why Saunders was being arrested. Neither officer responded to the question.

When Segui demanded that people back up, someone screamed, “Fuck you!” Then someone started to chant,“Bill Saunders! Bill Saunders! Bill Saunders!” The band on stage, momentarily silent, eventually took up the cadence of the chant.

People followed the officers as they took Saunders through the alley to Chapel Street. When the crowd started to follow, Segui could be seen on video physically pushing back one crowd member. She also could be seen deploying her pepper spray.

Segui said the interfering charge was a result of Saunders attempting to get away from officers. She testified that she charged him with inciting to riot charge because of what he said to the crowd, and the disorderly charge for the cumulative effect of all of his actions that day.

But What About The Noise?

Saunders attorney, Chris DeMarco, had a question: How did Segui know that the noise complaint was legit?

The city’s noise ordinance requires a decibel reading to be taken from the place where the complaint originated. Had she done that?

She had not done such a reading, she testified.

“We didn’t think we had to do that,” she said. A supervisor would have to do that anyway, she said. Patrol officers are not provided with such equipment.

“But you said that you arrested Bill for interfering with your investigation of the noise complaint,” DeMarco pressed.

“That’s not the only reason,” Segui replied.

“Ok, we can play that game,” DeMarco said.

He had another question: Where does a statute, or an ordinance, say that the permit has to be kept on the premise of an event?

Segui said she believed she’d seen that language on the permit itself. When DeMarco showed her a copy of the Ideat Village permit without that language, she said that it was the first time she’d ever seen that specific permit because Saunders, nor anyone affiliated with the festival, ever provided it to her.

She also indicated that it wasn’t a complete representation of the permit packet, which the chief of police has to sign off on, and therefore she couldn’t say where the language requiring that the permit to be kept onsite might be but she believed that the language did exist.

DeMarco next let her see the city’s rules regarding permits for special events like festivals which can be exempt from certain restrictions of the noise ordinance. He had her read aloud part of “Sec. 18-78. - Exemptions and special conditions,” of the city ordinance. It exempts “noise created by any lawful recreational activities, and for which the city has granted a license or permit, including but not limited to parades, sporting events, outdoor concerts, firework displays and non-amplified religious activities.”

“Never Got That Far”

Before DeMarco wrapped up his cross-examination he elicited testimony from Segui that called into question what she’d originally documented in her report six years ago and her testimony on Thursday.

For instance, in the report, she’d indicated that Saunders had been intoxicated. She did not say that in her testimony Thursday when describing his demeanor on that day. In the report, the man working the soundboard was identified as a drummer, and the person who called in the complaint was identified as more than one complainant.

“It was six years ago,” Segui said. But she indicated that she believed her report was accurate.

In all that happened leading up to Saunders arrest, DeMarco asked, was the music still playing?

“Yes,” Segui replied.

“Did you determine that in fact, there was a violation of the city noise ordinance?” he asked.

“We never got that far,” she said.

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posted by: Patricia Kane on June 22, 2018  8:35am

It takes special skill to turn a peaceful, legal music festival into a violent encounter.
  A noise complaint never merited the hostility this then officer exhibited. She didn’t shut the music down, but she did tell someone at the other end of her transmission that they were going to do that well before the arrest.
  A uniform does not entitle any police officer to bully any one. The law is supposed to protect us from an arrest without probable cause. Segui never identified a specific reason for the arrest prior to doing it.
  That the office of the State’s Attorney in New Haven kept Saunders on 24 hour alert for trial for over a year shows how politicized the entire process has become. The State doesn’t dismiss these marginal cases, but disrupts the individual’s life long enough to hope that they will be worn down and plead to something. In this case Saunders ultimately pled to an infraction.
  This bullying system has been exposed, regardless of the outcome.

posted by: Samuel T. Ross-Lee on June 22, 2018  8:52am

If only someone in the department had thought of the simple idea of giving the officers on duty a list of the permitted events before they went on duty, none of this would have happened. 

If only an officer on duty had reasonably assumed that an organized group of people would probably not gather in plain sight in defiance of the law and played loud music without permission (a permit) knowing at any moment, an officer could come by and shut them down. 

“For lack of a nail, they (started a) war.”

posted by: vpaul on June 22, 2018  9:24am

Prediction: Saunders wins, thanks to excellent cross-examination by Attorney DeMarco. Alders: simply amend the ordinance to require that such permits be kept on premises. Problem solved.

Wonder what the costs of this mindless prosecution are!

posted by: Patricia Kane on June 22, 2018  11:03am

@vpaul: this is a civil suit v. the City of New Haven and Segui. The criminal charges against Saunders were resolved by him pleading to an infraction.

posted by: RobotShlomo on June 22, 2018  11:51am

Can we please have better psychological evaluations for those who want to become police officers? While we’re at it, let’s train them better how to DE-escalate a situation, so it doesn’t have to result in more needless arrests, and eventual civil law suits. And that entails more than just screaming “STOP RESISTING”.

posted by: concerned_neighbor on June 22, 2018  1:33pm

a plea to an infraction negates an essential element of a false arrest claim. . . .hmmm. why all this irrelevant evidence about probable cause?

posted by: Patricia Kane on June 22, 2018  2:15pm

@concerned neighbor: The civil suit is for the unprovoked assault by Sgt. Segui. The over the top criminal charges alleged by Segui of “inciting a riot”, etc. were reduced by the State’s Attorney to the equivalent of a parking ticket. People issued parking tickets are not usually arrested and beaten. The case is awaiting a jury’s decision.

posted by: AliceB on June 22, 2018  2:58pm

Looks like the jury thought far differently than these posters

posted by: concerned_neighbor on June 22, 2018  4:11pm

Looks like the jury decided all counts in favor of the police defendants in about 2 hours.

Case closed.

posted by: T-ski1417 on June 22, 2018  5:44pm

It’s like reliving when Trump beat Clinton. Excellent job by Corp Council and the jury.

posted by: robn on June 22, 2018  6:19pm

2nd BS ruling in one year regarding police misconduct. Adds to the simmer in this town in a big bad way.

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 22, 2018  8:27pm

Robn,

I did not know what ‘my platform’ coming out of this court case was going to be….
I assumed more art and community!!!!

This outcome is not a positive message.  It discourages uses of public spaces, unless you are insiders like Arts and Ideas, or Town Green Special Services, who now runs a Happy Hour in Temple Plaza, which was the premiere location for Ideat Village in 2002.

This is where we are, New Haven….

The garbled procedures that aren’t ‘statutory’ enable the misapplication of public process.
Why weren’t the police aware of Ideat Village.? They are part of the permit process!!!

Are Community Policing and ‘De-escalation’ Training are not enforceable by any legal standard?
Makes sense—that stuff is more PR than anything, except when it egregiously fails, as in this case.


That is the real root of this case…...  getting beat up and arrested was just the sideshow!

posted by: RobotShlomo on June 22, 2018  10:40pm

Ideat Village Jury Sides With Cop


Of course they do. Of course they do.

“That’s all you can ask for,” he said. “That you get your shot. I don’t really understand the verdict but I hope it doesn’t continue to embolden the police department and their poor practices regarding the community.”

We can only hope.

posted by: JCFremont on June 23, 2018  6:32am

Well in the annals of New Haven some how I don’t see Bill’s stagecraft will be remembered along side Jim Morrison at The Arena will it? Maybe this should have been previewed Off Broadway at either Yale or Quinnipiac’s Law Schools.

posted by: the1king on June 23, 2018  7:57am

Another waste of time and money that the so called art community liberals think that they can do what ever they want.  He should have been charged with more.  There is no reason he needed to do what he did.  The police are doing there job.  The permit should have been there.  Stop complaining about everything.  By the way, why do we spend our tax money on some of these so called art events.  So these rich libs can feel good about themselves.  Bill stop wasting tax payer money

posted by: T-ski1417 on June 23, 2018  8:01am

Why is it a BS ruling, because it didn’t go the way you wanted I assume…...

posted by: alphabravocharlie on June 23, 2018  8:10am

Looks like the jury pool is much more reasonable than the NHI commenting pool.

posted by: Ozzie on June 23, 2018  9:04am

Most festivals run by the City are usually mentioned at the Officers roll call (at least that’s the way it was ) and if it was a private event they were usually required to hire an extra duty officer . Not sure which this fell under whether the organizer was to cheap to hire a Cop or somebody at the PD dropped the ball.

posted by: robn on June 23, 2018  9:05am

TSKI

1) Because when a festival director or anyone else insults a police officer, it is not a crime.
2) Because it’s the police departments responsibility to be aware of permitted events.
3) Because there is no legal requirement to keep an event permit on site.
4) Because the latter was used by the police to incite the festival director and artificially create cause for arrest.
5) Because the police academy obviously forgot to teach you and others Proper deescalation techniques.

posted by: Hill Resident on June 23, 2018  10:43am

Ofc. Segui WAS investigating a noise complaint, that is why she was there.She asked for the permit, it was never produced. Saunders made comments from the mic that incited a response (including ‘f$@k you’) from the crowd that put the officers in a tense situation. The plaintiff said it was a joke? Really ... he was only playing?  One thing those of us who are NOT a part of the ‘privileged class’ (yes I went there) do not do is ‘joke’ with law enforcement during an investigation of ANY kind. Then Saunders approaches the officer? After making a provoking comment you approach the officer??? Who does that? Saunders own attorney said he was known as a ‘pain in the ass of the powers that be’. Was he acting like one ... and if Bill Saunders truly IS a ‘gadfly’ (by definition an annoying person who provokes others into action by criticism), then it sounds like he was ‘poking the bear’!  We have venues in the ‘inner city’ that sometimes require permits (that we keep readily available to produce when asked by authorities (just like drivers permits, construction permits, parade or protest permits, gun permits) and some that don’t but we notify our police district manager to advise squad when we are having an event, like hosting movie night in the community garden, so they will be aware that many people will be gathering in a public space. And we want to ensure in advance that any police presence will be for cause and warranted. We do this because we know we don’t have the privilege of ‘why can’t I act the way I want to act regardless of how others may view it even if it is provocative because I’m entitled (key word) to my feelings about a situations regardless of how anyone else feels about it.’ It does ‘take a special skill to turn a peaceful, legal music festival into a violent encounter’ ... I agree. So in addition to ‘gadfly’ and ‘pain in the ass’, this skill set can be added to his CV. That is my opinion ... one of the few entitlements I have. Say what you will.

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 23, 2018  1:58pm

Your right, 1King,

Us damn liberals putting on a free community event for 11 years, using zero tax dollars, public spaces and a public process…...  This stuff is just intolerable!!!!

By the way, I have zero problem with the jury—they did the job they. were charged to do.
Unfortunately, the way ‘the law’ is written made it difficult for a favorable outcome…

T-ski—You get to snipe at me all you want.  It was a bullshit verdict because it goes against notions of community, inclusion, and public. process.  While the case failed to prove itself to ‘the legal standard’, the court of public opinion is just as worthy a venue!

Let the conversation continue!!!!

posted by: Atwater on June 23, 2018  2:07pm

1King, publicly funded art shows, events, festivals benefit the community by engendering exposure to a artistic expression and fostering stronger community ties and bonds. And, art is nice to look at and to hear and be immersed in. I always loved the Ideat Village festival, especially the music in Pitkin Plaza, it felt a lot more inclusive and collaborative than the offerings of the Arts & Ideas Festival (but I do like the A&I Festival). What happened to Mr. Saunders was an injustice, pure and simple. There is no rule that says a permit must be displayed at all times. There was no cause for the police officer to do what she did or to even ask for the permit. A simple call to her supervisor probably would have cleared up any question about the legality of the music. Sure, Mr. Saunders could have handled himself differently, but the police, as officers of the law and civil servants, have need to be held to a higher standard and should conduct themselves according to the law and to the a common sense of decency and fairness. I’m not surprised by the jury’s verdict, cops are given a wide berth in re discretion by civil juries, this verdict is typical, which is disappointing. I hope it doesn’t discourage anyone from organizing the next “Ideat Village” type of festival. We need more art, more music, more plays, etc., not less.

posted by: AliceB on June 23, 2018  6:20pm

You know why the jury found as they did?  The attorney from Corp Council is damn good that is why.
The Officer was in the right, another reason why.  Mr. Saunders was WRONG.  The jury wasn’t fooled by the dog and pony show of the plaintiff.

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 23, 2018  6:36pm

Hill Resident,

The police were notified and part of the legal permitting process, as was administered by Win Davis of Town Green Special Services on behalf of The New Haven Parks Department.  We paid $160 dollars for this contract and also purchased infrastructure like ‘port-a-potties’ as were required.  We even used the City’s vendor and got the City Price, thanks to Economic Development Head, Tony Bialecki.

It was a legally permitted festival… The Police signed off on it… Where was their ‘copy’?
The single ‘noise complaint’ should have been dealt with at dispatch as such…

‘There is a permitted event happening, if you would like us to come by and check the noise readings in your apartment, we would be happy to’.

I often wonder what would have happened if the timing were off by a few seconds, and I had just left the plaza as I was on the verge of doing….

We did have a concurrent gallery event going on that we had invited the Mayor to…
Of course, he never showed…..  or maybe he ‘did’—at least the flawed process that belongs to him that set these events into motion.

I don’t know how much more ‘open’ and ‘up front’ about the event we could have been…..

Is your disfavor with me because I am a white male, Hill resident???
I never let labels get in the way of community or inclusion, so snipe away!!!!!

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 23, 2018  8:54pm

And still no Civilian Review Board, as is required by Charter…....

And more, similar cases to come….(Groucho Marx voice)

Did you here the one about the un-permitted White Supremacy Festival on the Green, where
The Black Activists got beat up?  Not by the ‘Proud Boys’, but by the local COPS!!!!

And then there is still the one about being detained for being a Black version of myself…..

You can’t make this stuff up.

posted by: 1644 on June 24, 2018  7:49am

Bill:  The rule pronounced by the police chief is that groups of 15 or less do not need permits, at least so long as they aren’t going to be obstructing others from the use of private spaces.  Thus, if you and a few friends want to stand on a sidewalk, or The Green, with signs, you do not need a permit.  Thus,  there was no requirement for the Ground Boys to have a permit.  The counter-protesters, on the other hand, were greater in number, and should have had a permit for their counter-demonstration.  Some of the counter-protesters were violent, and were properly arrested, though not for assault.
    As for your case,  you did follow procedures, and clearly some at the police department was derelict in their duty to pass the notice of your permitted function to the dispatchers and the beat cops. Given the general lack of accountability and discipline in US police forces in general, and in NHPD, I doubt there was an after-action report and meaningful consequences meted out the those who failed in their duties, but that’s another issue. 
  That said,  your admitted statement that the police would have to arrest a lot of people was clearly a threat to order and the police.  You did, in fact, succeed in turning the crowd on the police, and making the officers fear for their safety.  Using the microphone to rile up the crowd was ill-advised.  The police were dealing calmly with you, but you got excited.

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 24, 2018  1:13pm

1644,

And the police were never dealing with me calmly.
Sgt. Segui was fully escalated in EVERY interaction with me…. She was the inciter. 

I was only trying to comply.

posted by: Hill Resident on June 24, 2018  9:52pm

No Bill - I have no disfavor with you because you are a white male. But the fact that you would not even consider that I have disfavor because you are ... might be ... could possibly be wrong just kind of bolsters my claim of your sense of self entitlement. And that my friend is my issue for which I have neither favor nor disfavor. You got on the mic and made remarks that incited the crowd to react with hostility towards the police. You said you were only joking but the police didn’t think so and neither did the crowd. Instead of laughing they boo’d and cursed the police. And for that you got arrested. You can’t say whatever you want, wherever you want, however you want to whomever you want ... you just cannot.

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 25, 2018  1:07am

1644,

Also, I would like to see the statute the requires permits based on attendance size of greater than ‘15’ in public spaces.  I have never seen that in any of the 40+ permits I have taken out for public spaces.
In fact, I may be the record holder for taking out permits for public spaces— while you need to report the ‘estimated attendance’ of the event, ‘attendance size’ is not something that is even acknowledged in the necessary permit paperwork. 

Also, how do counter-protesters get a permit to protest on a Saturday when they find out about an ‘unpermitted event’ that is soon to happen.  Non-sensical and not part of ANY process.

I think Chief Campbell is making stuff up, unless he can provide a legal citation.
What these cops ‘say’ doesn’t count anymore…. that has been proven again and again!
What is written in their police reports are lies to cover their own violations of the public trust!!!!!

There are several recent reports of similar actions regarding untrustworthy incident reporting by Police in other articles on this website.  In fact, it is a general experience of the populace.

=
Provide the statute please, and where it exists as part of the public permitting process, and you will actually get an apology from me.

I don’t think either of us is holding our breath!

Statute Please…....

posted by: T-ski1417 on June 25, 2018  5:30am

@robn

It tough to deescalate when the “Festival Director “ tries to incite. He is really a tough guy inciting the crowd against two officers. He got his a@& handed to him rightfully so.

At the end a jury decided that BS was full
of BS and I’ve never been to a police academy.  Have you???

posted by: 1644 on June 25, 2018  9:45am

Bill:  Yes, I believe the 15 persons rule is one that Campbell made up.  He has certainly applied it to groups who espouse views more popular than the Proud Boys, such as ULA holding a rally on City Hall steps.  I would hope we could agree that one or two persons holding a sign on a sidewalk, saying, either “Trump is Great” or “Stop the War,” etc., would not require a permit. (Remember, is is illegal to discriminate based on viewpoint.). I suppose if I wanted to rally thirty people with “Bomb More Babies” signs to counter one person with a “Stop the War” sign, I would need to wait for a different day. 
  Perhaps fifteen isn’t the right number, but so long as they aren’t blocking my access, I really don’t care if a few folks gather outside my bank to protest a pipeline, or whatever they want to protest.  It would be helpful if there were a formal, written policy about what size group required a permit.
  Note:  Re The Ground Boys, I believe one black counter-protester got arrested via a physical takedown, though not “beat-up”, and two other, out-of-town, violent, white counter-protesters were also arrested.

posted by: Trustme on June 25, 2018  10:45am

Hey Bill, I’m pretty sure you acted liked a perfect saint during that interaction…. Take the L and stop with all the excuses… thank god for all the commentating support you have on NHI, that fills your ego and makes you feel righteous. On another note Russia is down 0-2 to Uruguay.

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 25, 2018  12:42pm

Trust Me,

The truth is out there…
More lawsuits from other victims to come….

posted by: Squarn on June 25, 2018  2:59pm

Hill Resident you are 100% right; entitlement with a capital E!

Our “gadfly”- a gross misuse of this word if there ever was one- thought he could stir up a crowd by crying oppression. He got called on it and spanked and rightly so; you don’t play games with people who put their lives on the line every day. Six years and an untold amount city man hours and tax dollars flushed down the toilet later, the crusade for “inclusion” (can we all agree that this is nothing but a flimsy euphemism for “wounded pride”?) dies a dishonorable death in the sunlight of common sense.

Might as well laugh it up, New Haveners, and enjoy Saunders’ six year “performance art” piece; you paid for it!

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 25, 2018  7:47pm

Sqarn,

Keep trying to disparage me. 

This isn’t about ‘ego’ or an ‘art project’, but a community discussion about Police Behavior in our community.  I will continue to stand my ground.

While my case happened six years ago, recent police actions in the last two years—the taser incident the latest that comes to mind.  The Independent Reporter caught behind ‘enemy lines’ during a ‘bomb scare’.  The Fair Family, and their targeted assaults…..  Nate Blair….

This stuff hasn’t gotten better, it has gotten worse. 

The thousands of local artists and musicians that were served over Ideat Village’s 11 year run know the real truth about community art and inclusion.  The politicians who tried to stop our festival over that the same period know their culpability as well.

As always, the ones that weren’t there, who judge on ‘snippets’, who don’t post under their real names, are the experts.  They are generally the insiders and cronies.  If you want to gripe about Ideat Village, take out a permit and put on a free festival for your community…..  it will make everybody feel good inside! 

The process is there for everybody.  Use it!

SqarnFest ‘19 !!!!!! 
I, for one, will be there!

posted by: LEO555 on June 26, 2018  2:16pm

Congrats officer Segui!!!

posted by: wendy1 on June 27, 2018  4:18pm

More like IDIOT VILLAGE…....

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 27, 2018  10:54pm

Leo,

If you would like to congratulate NHPD for lying under oath to save the taxpayers 25k, I am sure you might find some small-minded people to support you.  That is about equivalent to any of these ludicrous management raises.  Matt Nemerson comes to mind.

Personally, I am going to save my ‘congrats’ until when ‘Superfly’ Sgt. Segui wins the WWE’s ‘Women’s Championship Belt’.  As an unwitting public sparring partner, I can vouch for her behind the back takedown skills….

posted by: the1king on June 28, 2018  4:47pm

bill, take the loss.  This is perfect example how libs act if they don’t get their way.  They attack and cry.  Stop attacking the police officer.  The juror found that you were wrong.  It gets so tiring.  This is so stupid that you are wasting resources on this.  Then making attacks on people is just not nice.  You would not want it done to you.

posted by: Bill Saunders on June 28, 2018  7:23pm

the1king,

I have taken the loss quite well…. It has inspired my ‘activism’!
Look at my statement at the beginning of this article to understand my ‘position’.
You are not allowed to make stuff up.

The fact of the matter is, if a funny looking white guy beat a brutality rap, it would say so much more than ‘we are all completely f—-ed’.  As it turns out WE, as regular citizens, are all on the same side vis a vis NHPD.

Go ahead—try and denigrate me some more.
The next hired gun in line will get a similar response from me.

I am on the side of the people, regardless of race of race, age, or gender.

As it stands now, from what I can tell from the ‘decision’, Police Brutality and Over-reach is an equal opportunity expectation.  The Blue lies are rampant!  That is a reassuring ‘concept’ for the community.

I only hope future litigants have better luck dealing with this abusive system.